[Fis] Five Clouds over Fundamental Information Science.

[Xueshan Yan]

Dear Krassimir,

Your replay raised some important issues, and I would like to share my views with you.

1.	On Animal Informatics: Essentially, Cloud 2 is an extension of Cloud 4. When we replace an ordinary inforware with an organism that has a brain, it immediately becomes an animal. When animal could use complex human language to communicate, it becomes a human inforware. In my opinion, cross-level communication by true language comprehension is impossible. To achieve effective outcomes, we need to make wise decisions among hundreds of potential informatics, and firmly abandon those information efforts that lack research value. For instance, though bee information exists, we currently lack the ability to study it.
2.	On Whether Fundamental Information Science Can Become an Independent Science: Fundamental Information Science is a term used by Pedro, while Wolfgang refers it as to Unified Theory of Information, and I denote it as Unified Information Science; however, their meanings are the same. To reduce confusion for readers, I primarily use the term "fundamental information science" for consistency in our community. Regarding whether fundamental information science can become an independent scientific discipline, my optimistic prediction is: if we can establish a small but delicate information theory within the next 15 years, it would be a significant achievement.
3.	On Writing Style: Reflecting on our past mailing list, the contributions from Joseph, Gordana, you, and others undoubtedly set some exemplary standards for FIS writing. If we wish FIS to become a center for global thinkers in fundamental information science, it is essential that everyone considers their readers first when writing posts. Beyond the depth of thought, we should avoid excessive links and too many acquaintance references; an overabundance of self-referencing is counterproductive. The harmonious unity of form and content should be ultimate goal.
4.	On Genetics: Up to now, many traditional or emerging disciplines related to information have claimed to be an informatics or to become one, such as statistics, chemistry, and so on. In this regard, can researchers in fundamental information science design a set of criteria to evaluate these disciplines? I nominate genetics as the first and developed one that merits the title of informatics. This is because it not only clarifies the transmission of genetic information in terms of synchronicity and diachronicity but also provides clear explanations of information, signs, and substrates. While genetics is a complex and challenging field, understanding it in the context of molecular biology is even more demanding. Nevertheless, genetics truly serves as a model discipline for all areas aspiring to achieve the status of informatics.

Best wishes,

Xueshan

 

Appendix: Some disciplines that claim to be or will be informatics in the books or articles of the claimants (please supplement and improve):

1. 1994, Chentao, China, Statement: Geography is an information science.

2. 1995, Jean-Marie Lehn, French, (Nobel laureate in Chemistry), Statement: Supramolecular chemistry has paved the way toward understanding chemistry as an information science.

3. 2002, Leroy E. Hood, United States, (Nobel laureate in Physiology or Medicine), Statement: Biology is an informational science.

4. 2005, Bradley Efron, United States, (President of the American Statistics Society), Statement: Statistics is an information science, the first and most fully developed information science.

5. 2011, James Gleick, United States, (American Science Writer), Statement: Economics is recognizing itself as an information science.

6. 2013, John Fellingham, United States, Statement: Accounting is an information science.

 

From: fis-bounces at listas.unizar.es <fis-bounces at listas.unizar.es> On Behalf Of Krassimir Markov
Sent: Monday, December 16, 2024 10:49 AM
To: fis <fis at listas.unizar.es>
Subject: Re: [Fis] Five Clouds over Fundamental Information Science.

 

Dear Xueshan,

 

Regarding your question in section

 

Cloud 2. Brain Informatics or Animal Informatics:

Can we assume that there are as many types of animal informatics as there are animal species?

 

I would like to note that there must obviously be a difference in the models that we build for different animal species, since the structure of the brain differs, for example, there is a neocortex in mammals, while in other animals it is not.

 

A very important distinguishing feature of humans, in relation to other animals, is the presence of writing and specific only to humans written information interaction, part of which is this letter.

 

There is no other animal that uses e-mail :-) !!!

 

In connection with

 

Cloud 5. Exploration of Fundamental Information Science

and your question: Does Fundamental Information Science (FIS) exist at all?

 

I would like to note that at the moment I do not see a clear definition of FIS as an independent science, but in my opinion it is possible that such a scientific direction will appear in the future.

 

The interdisciplinarity that exists within our community prevents the formation of a relatively separate direction. 

 

This is also evident from the discussions in the FIS list, which are usually superficial without the possibility of in-depth insight into the problems, due to the unpreparedness of the audience regarding the necessary special knowledge on each of the discussed issues, as well as the unwillingness of the presenters to answer “simple” questions, which leads to a huge burden on the listeners, who need to deal with tons of specialized literature from new areas for them.

 

I consider it an inappropriate approach to say a few words and throw a list of literature for “acquaintance” at the reader!

 

At the same time, small teams of highly qualified scientists who have in-depth knowledge of more than one or two scientific directions would achieve significant success. This is evidenced by a number of publications whose authors are part of well-prepared interdisciplinary teams.

 

I will refrain from commenting on Cloud 3, as I am not an expert in the field of genetics, as well as Cloud 1 and Cloud 4 for the opposite reason. The latter requires a long conversation and small comments would do more harm than help to clarify the issues. For me, they are of particular importance, which is also evident from the main theme of the IS4SI Summit 2025: “The Key Role of Information Interaction” (https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://is4si.org/summit-2025/__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!VqQ3EkJrn6skaEGNx112K0HA7I0qClkhWm9d_ARK70pwQjdJ-H9ImkxhQ_6tFyalXXMJtMaeLjMskDbL$  <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/is4si.org/summit-2025/__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!TdrWSw6KLuOFyYhAWXj-5GOp3i80kymnaej420hAyORTgf5T6vU34In2sg0Omx7L-756LSyRJPgaNfDE6vI$> ).

 

With respect,

Krassimir

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