[Fis] Abstract--Electronic Symbiosis—Lessons from Bacteria
Pedro C. Marijuan
pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es
Wed Feb 17 21:33:00 CET 2021
Thanks Howard (& Plamen, Krassimir, Karl... and All). Please, consider
the following two-pronged argument:
Of all species that have existed on Earth, 99.9 percent are now extinct.
Habitat destruction is the leading cause of endangerment and extinction.
Introduced species -- those who migrate to a new area -- are the second
leading cause of endangerment and extinction. You cannot put new species
together to coexist happily (like hippie communes). So many cases of
plagues and pathogens that have put other species to the brisk of
extinction... A few easy cases I directly remember: Dutch elm disease by
several fungi; Ash dieback by another fungus and a borer insect;
traditional Grapevine in France, Spain, Italy, etc. in early 20th
Century exterminated by mildew; the Irish potato blight; Bee hives
knocked by Verroa destructor and by Asian wasps, Rabbits wiped by
Myxomatosis, etc. etc. In general, we call plagues and illnesses to
that multitude of inter-species nasty encounters.
Establishing a fruitful inter-species coexistence in the form of
Symbiosis is exceptional and takes a lot of "co-evolutionary work". And
perhaps it also occurs socially. The great things you correctly describe
have been accomplished yes, but being accompanied by major social crises
and upheavals. Even today: the recent ugly events in your country (or
the calamitous situation of my own country) are not a light reminder of
the increased destabilization risks we live in. ICTs and AI imply major
risks of social-economic disarray and discord, and a lot of "social
intelligentsia" work will be needed to achieve a happier coexistence.
The problem I see is precisely a parallel decrease of the adaptive
"social intelligentsia" capability (including science, but not
technology). What about climatic change, ecological crisis, resource
depletion...? Why aren't we seriously confronting these challenges yet?
Best--Pedro
El 16/02/2021 a las 0:23, Howard Bloom escribió:
> re: This biological argument is based on an exception. For /most
> /inter-species long term evolutionary encounters conduce to...
> extinction.
>
> pedro, hi, could you give me some examples of interspecies encounters
> leading to extinction? to me, that would seem the exception to the
> rule. a cluster of different species living together in an ecological
> community benefit from keeping each other alive. despite their habit
> of eating each other.
>
> re: Plamen, thanks for the comment. "I wish we were smart enough to
> push it forward into practice. Are we?"
>
> hb: we often accomplish miracles with no consciousness of what we've
> done. I hope that happens here.
>
> examples of material miracles we've made but have failed to plan or see:
>
> ·If you’d been born in 1850, your expected lifespan would have
> been 37.5 years. If you’d been born in the West in 2000, your
> expected lifespan would have been 78.5 years. Chinese Emperors
> were willing to spend almost all of their wealth to achieve an
> extra four years of life. But Western Civilization has added
> another 40. Western civilization has more than doubled the human
> lifespan. No other civilization in the history of the world—not
> the Chinese, Egyptian, Muslim, Russian Marxist, or Roman—has ever
> pulled this off.
> ·If you’d been the poorest paid worker in London in 2012, a
> personal assistant, you would have earned what an entire tenement
> full of the poorest paid workers in London were paid in 1850. You
> would have earned what seven Irish dockworkers made.
> ·If you gave a bunch of average Western kids today a Stanford
> Binet IQ test from 1900, today’s kids would register as near
> geniuses. They’d register an average IQ of roughly 135. That’s an
> IQ Jump of 35 points.
> ·If you were in an indigenous culture, one of those tribes that
> “lives in peace and harmony with nature,” your odds of dying a
> violent death at the hands of a fellow human being would be ten
> times what they are in the West today. Since 1650, Western
> Civilization has upped the level of peace by a factor of ten.
> ·If you were born in 2000, your height would have been four inches
> higher than if you’d been born in 1850.
> ·The Western System has lifted close to a billion people out of
> poverty in a mere twenty years.[i]
> <file:///C:/Users/ZK/Dropbox/text/facts%20and%20figures.doc#_edn1>
> however you are right. there's always a chance that we could blow
> it. or that we could built algorithms into military ai that
> ultimately decide that we are the enemy and need to be killed.
>
> with warmth and oomph--howard
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> [i]
> <file:///C:/Users/ZK/Dropbox/text/facts%20and%20figures.doc#_ednref1>
> https://www.economist.com/leaders/2013/06/01/towards-the-end-of-poverty
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dr. Plamen L. Simeonov <plamen.l.simeonov at gmail.com>
> To: Pedro C. Marijuan <pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>
> Cc: fis <fis at listas.unizar.es>
> Sent: Mon, Feb 15, 2021 1:55 pm
> Subject: Re: [Fis] Abstract--Electronic Symbiosis—Lessons from Bacteria
>
> I fully agree with you, Pedro, and your note about Michael Conrad.
> Unfortunately, this challenging era we live now is certainly a great
> opportunity, as Howard suggests, but also at least 50% chance to
> surrender to what will come next to replace us as individuals. But I
> know that Howard has another receipt suggesting the development of the
> global interconnected mind (the "Avatar" movie idea) which is a nice
> goal we can evolve too, but from what I have been observing in the
> world during this pandemic, I conclude only that this mind is of a
> weird and perplexed global being. The only hope is that this state of
> illness will be over within a certain period of time.
>
> Great books and a great theory, Howard! I wish we were smart enough to
> push it forward into practice.
> Are we?
>
> Best,
>
> Plamen
>
>
>
> ___ ___ ___
> *Dr. Plamen L. Simeonov*
> Director Integral Biomathics
> /MolBio*^2 *Math <http://www.simeio.org/focus/about/molbio2math/>/ –**
> <http://www.simeio.org/focus/about/molbio2math/>/Molecular
> Biology & Integral Biomathics
> <http://www.simeio.org/focus/about/molbio2math/>/
> a non-profit Foundation Institute
> Arnimallee 22, 14195 Berlin, Germany
>
> phone1: +1 (213) 281-5921
> phone2: +49 173 7816 337
> email: plamen at simeio.org <mailto:plamen at simeio.org>
> URLs: https://www.linkedin.com/in/plamenlsimeonov/
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> inbiosa.eu <http://inbiosa.eu/> | molbio2math.org
> <http://www.molbio2math.org/>
> OurWorldInData.org/coronavirus <https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus>
> https://groups.google.com/d/forum/covid-19-therapy
>
>
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> Scopus Author ID: 7006001629
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> On Mon, Feb 15, 2021 at 7:44 PM Pedro C. Marijuan
> <pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es <mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>> wrote:
>
> Thanks Krassimir, it looks a good idea.
> Those parties sending their abstracts, we should understand, are
> asking for discussion.
> Then, here there are some comments on Howard's.
>
> "What’s more, the cellulose eaters could defecate material that
> was toast with butter and jam to the cockroaches, the perfect
> food-- sugars and short-chain fatty acids..."
> Quite right. Waste of one species becomes excellent food for
> another. I was then reminded Jerry's recent comments on entropy as
> being somehow analogous with "forms of natural wastes, such as
> feces, dung, shit, urine, etc." Well, it depends. Entropy itself,
> in Gibbs' free energy, becomes a frequent positive contribution to
> the chemical reaction free energy (when there is an entropy
> increase of products respect reactants). And it often helps in
> enzyme function too (e.g., by entropy change in vicinal water that
> empowers the enzyme for overcoming the activation energy barrier).
> Things in nature usually work in a series of conjugated, networked
> yin-yang relationships--rather than absolutes.
>
> About the substance of the abstract, Who knows? Michel Conrad made
> a curious relationship --tradeoff principle-- between
> adaptability, evolvability, and information processing. An
> increase of the latter diminishes the former. So, we may find less
> capable people as they rely more and more on external algorithms
> or processing gadgets... is it already happening with the current
> generation, socially less and less adapted precisely because of
> their over-immersion onto "social networks"?
>
> "If all goes well, that will be the relationship of AI and
> humankind—symbiosis. Mutual empowerment." Not necessarily. This
> biological argument is based on an exception. For /most
> /inter-species long term evolutionary encounters conduce to...
> extinction.
>
> Gloom and Doom!
> --Pedro
>
> El 14/02/2021 a las 16:57, Krassimir Markov escribió:
>> Dear Howard,
>> Thank you for the abstract.
>> You are right!
>>
>> Dear Pedro,
>> Maybe it is a good idea to discuss some abstracts in FIS list.
>> I think, the moderators of sessions may take a such decision.
>> Friendly greetings
>> Krassimir
>> *From:* Howard Bloom <mailto:howlbloom at aol.com>
>> *Sent:* Sunday, February 14, 2021 3:06 AM
>> *To:* fis at listas.unizar.es <mailto:fis at listas.unizar.es> ;
>> pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es <mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>
>> *Subject:* [Fis] Abstract--Electronic Symbiosis—Lessons from Bacteria
>> i've submitted the following abstract to wolfgang hofkirchner for
>> his digital humanism section of the conference:
>>
>> Electronic Symbiosis—Lessons from Bacteria
>> Howard Bloom
>> howlbloom at aol.com <mailto:howlbloom at aol.com>
>> Author, The Lucifer Principle: a Scientific Expedition into
>> the Forces of History
>> Chairman, The Howard Bloom Institute
>> Founder and co-chair, The Asian Space Technology Summit
>> Former Visiting Scholar, Graduate Psychology Department, New
>> York University
>> Former Core Faculty Member, The Graduate Institute, Meriden,
>> Connecticut
>>
>> Some say that we should not let humanity’s new electronic
>> frontiers reshape us. But every time technology has reshaped
>> us, it has upgraded us. To see how synergies with electronic
>> systems like artificial intelligence can give humanity and
>> humanism new powers, look at how bacteria have gained new
>> abilities over the last billion years. They could have
>> anticipated being annihilated by the new multicellulars and
>> tried to stop multicellular formation. But the multicellulars
>> did not wipe out their single-celled forebears. Far from it.
>> They worked out deals with the multi-cellulars. And those
>> cooperative arrangements gave both the microbes and the
>> multi-cellular beasts whole new powers, whole new ways to
>> make a living. Look, for example, at the cockroaches that
>> first showed up on the planet 320 million years ago. For 69
>> million years, the cockroaches were limited to easily
>> digestible food. But there was hard stuff all around them
>> bursting with nourishment. That oh, too solid stuff was the
>> tree. And there was no way that the digestive system of
>> cockroaches could turn bark and wood into tasty treats. Then
>> came over 33 species of bacteria and set up shop in the
>> cockroach’s guts. Species like Paenibacillus lactis,
>> Lysinibacillusmacrolides, and Stenotrophomonas
>> maltophilia.[i] These microbial wonders could eat cellulose,
>> the hard stuff that had previously made wood indigestible.
>> What’s more, the cellulose eaters could defecate material
>> that was toast with butter and jam to the cockroaches, the
>> perfect food-- sugars and short-chain fatty acids. In
>> exchange, the microbes used cockroaches as their transport
>> and chewing machines. The cockroaches empowered by their
>> bacterial colonists to eat trees took off on an evolutionary
>> path of their own. Today we call them termites. And there are
>> 2,000 species of them. Which means that once the lowly
>> cockroach allowed cellulose-eating bacteria and flagellates
>> to turn its innards into a microbial dining hall, the newly
>> empowered cockroaches found 2,000 new ways to make a living.
>> So, no, multicellular beings did not wipe out their
>> single-celled progenitors. They gave them a rich new home.
>> And they gavet he unicellulars breathtaking new abilities. If
>> all goes well, that will be the relationship of AI and
>> humankind—symbiosis. Mutual empowerment.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Karl Javorszky <karl.javorszky at gmail.com>
>> <mailto:karl.javorszky at gmail.com>
>> To: 钟义信 <zyx at bupt.edu.cn> <mailto:zyx at bupt.edu.cn>
>> Cc: fis <fis at listas.unizar.es> <mailto:fis at listas.unizar.es>;
>> Pedro <pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es> <mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>
>> Sent: Fri, Feb 12, 2021 11:15 pm
>> Subject: Re: [Fis] 回复： New Year in China
>>
>> Please resend the 2 papers, as my office software says it doesn't
>> recognize the file format used.
>> Thanks
>> Karl
>> 钟义信 <zyx at bupt.edu.cn <mailto:zyx at bupt.edu.cn>> schrieb am Sa.,
>> 13. Feb. 2021, 03:29:
>>
>> Dear Pedro,
>>
>> Please accept my warm greetings to you for the outstanding
>> contributions you made to IS4SI during the past years and
>> also for the Chinese new year..
>>
>> Here I would send you two documents of the Calls, see
>> attachment, as some progresses made by China Chapter for the
>> preparations for IS4SI World Summit-2021. I would be very
>> grateful if you could help us by distributing the Calls to
>> FISers.
>>
>> My best regards,
>>
>> Yixin
>> ------------------ 原始邮件 ------------------
>> *发件人:* "Pedro"<pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es
>> <mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>>;
>> *发送时间:* 2021年2月13日(星期六) 凌晨5:43
>> *收件人:* "fis"<fis at listas.unizar.es
>> <mailto:fis at listas.unizar.es>>;
>> *主题:* [Fis] New Year in China
>> Dear FIS Colleagues,
>>
>> With the occasion of the Chinese New Year, let me express our
>> collective
>> greetings and best wishes to the FISers there. We badly need
>> good news,
>> and at least the celebrations of a New Year bring us some
>> sense of hope
>> and forbearance in front of the present difficulties.
>> Probably, when all
>> of this recedes, we will be able to make fine discussions
>> about social
>> resilience...
>>
>> All the best
>>
>> --Pedro
>>
>> --
>> -------------------------------------------------
>> Pedro C. Marijuán
>> Grupo de Bioinformación / Bioinformation Group
>>
>> pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es <mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>
>> http://sites.google.com/site/pedrocmarijuan/
>> -------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> --
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>>
>> __________________________
>> Howard Bloom
>> Howardbloom.net
>> trailer for BRIC-TV's 66-minute film,The Grand Unified Theory of
>> Howard Bloom, https://youtu.be/rGkOkChazUQ
>> Best Picture, Science Design Film Festival. Best Documentary
>> Feature, Not Film Festival, Italy. Now available on Apple TV,
>> Amazon, Google Play, Microsoft, Vimeo, Vudu, and Fandango.
>>
>> Author of: The Lucifer Principle: A Scientific Expedition Into
>> the Forces of History ("mesmerizing"-The Washington Post),
>> Global Brain: The Evolution of Mass Mind From The Big Bang to the
>> 21st Century ("reassuring and sobering"-The New Yorker),
>> The Genius of the Beast: A Radical Re-Vision of Capitalism ("A
>> tremendously enjoyable book." James Fallows, National
>> Correspondent, The Atlantic),
>> The God Problem: How A Godless Cosmos Creates ("Bloom's argument
>> will rock your world." Barbara Ehrenreich),
>> How I Accidentally Started the Sixties (“Wow! Whew! Wild!
>> Wonderful!” Timothy Leary),
>> The Mohammed Code (“A terrifying book…the best book I’ve read on
>> Islam.” David Swindle, PJ Media), and
>> Einstein, Michael Jackson & Me: a Search for Soul in the Power
>> Pits of Rock & Roll ("Amazing. The writing is revelatory." Freddy
>> DeMann, manager of Michael Jackson and Madonna), Best Book of
>> 2020, New York Weekly Times.
>> A Quartz Magazine Pro
>> Former Visiting Scholar, Graduate Psychology Department, New York
>> University, Former Core Faculty Member, The Graduate Institute;
>> Current Kepler Space Institute Senior Scholar.
>> Founder: International Paleopsychology Project. Founder, Space
>> Development Steering Committee. Member Of Board Of Governors,
>> National Space Society. Founding Board Member: Epic of Evolution
>> Society. Founding Board Member, The Darwin Project.
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
> --
> -------------------------------------------------
> Pedro C. Marijuán
> Grupo de Bioinformación / Bioinformation Group
>
> pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es <mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es>
> http://sites.google.com/site/pedrocmarijuan/
> -------------------------------------------------
>
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--
-------------------------------------------------
Pedro C. Marijuán
Grupo de Bioinformación / Bioinformation Group
pcmarijuan.iacs at aragon.es
http://sites.google.com/site/pedrocmarijuan/
-------------------------------------------------
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