[Fis] FIS discussions. What is information - Shannons numbers or nature's numbers?

[Jerry LR Chandler]

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>> Begin forwarded message:
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>> From: Jerry LR Chandler <jerry_lr_chandler at icloud.com <mailto:jerry_lr_chandler at icloud.com>>
>> Subject: Re: [Fis] FIS discussions
>> Date: October 13, 2019 at 10:56:19 PM CDT
>> To: annette.grathoff at is4si.org <mailto:annette.grathoff at is4si.org>
>> Cc: fis <fis at listas.unizar.es <mailto:fis at listas.unizar.es>>
>> 
>> Dear Annette, List 
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>>> On Oct 13, 2019, at 4:04 PM, annette.grathoff at is4si.org <mailto:annette.grathoff at is4si.org> wrote:
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>>> The next huge difficulty (connected to the unclear status of matter) is to model the influence of what makes a difference on relationships which enable matter. Threshold levels are nice, but how can the quality of relationships be in-formed through the special quality (pattern) carried and transmitted by a difference which makes a difference? Philosophy helps us in understanding how meaningful communication can develop in contextual environments and Sociology hints to connections between meaningfulness and stability respectively cooperation and trust. But this both is observed in very highly developed systems and provides little help for understanding more basic dynamics. Regarding those, I bet on wave mechanics to promote our basic knowledge here (but you know that I got very involved in this in my project, so bias is not excluded).
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>> What are the objectives of the inquiry into the scientific nature of information? It seems that the very name, FIS, suggests that Shannon information is insufficient for scientific information.  One might ask “Why”?  Is it because of the nature of matter?  Do the constraints on the nature of matter the boundary of the concept of information?  
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>> One aspect of Shannon information is that it requires that the transmissible form of information be represented in terms of bits and bytes.  Indeed, bits and bytes are the only permissible forms of representation of Shannon information.  The units of Shannon information are numeric of indefinite magnitude, are they not? As numeric units, Shannon units are unbounded in scale and are unlimited in scope.  This fact that Shannon information can represent unbounded scales (magnitudes) is one key element of the wildly successful theory.
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>> Another aspect of information is the scope of the meanings of information. What are the limits on the scope of Shannon information?  How are the scope of the bits and bytes represented in the the theory? Is the scope of a Shannon message constrained numerically in any way?  If so, how is the scope of information represented in a Shannon message?
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>> The Shannon hypothesis of Information is that all communication can be  encoded into transmissible forms of numbers that contain the message.
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>> Does the same hypothesis,  the same critical concept, apply to the neighboring concept of real scientific information, that is, the natural forms of scientific information as used by working scientists (physicists, engineers, chemists, biologists, physicians, ecologists, and other specialists)?
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>>  Is this a conundrum?
>> Or, it merely a matter of "getting the physics right”?
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>> By the way, I would argue that the clarity of the status of matter, i.e., the chemical table of elements and their compositions, augmented by a huge range of physical measurements that span variables from all physical units of measure, is vastly clearer than any theory of physics. 
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>>  Does not the theory of wave mechanics emanate from the physics of atoms and composites?   Or, shall we simply agree that the relationships from between physical theories form a “which came first, the chicken or the egg?”
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>> Cheers
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>> Jerry
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>> “The union of units unite the unity."
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