<html><head></head><body><div class="ydpb4075f84yahoo-style-wrap" style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 24px;"><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;">kate, your question about emotional contagion and what we can call "the cloud effect" is a good one.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="">about this statement, with which i deeply agree:</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style=""><br><blockquote style="padding-left: 10px; border-left: 2px solid rgb(15, 105, 255); margin-left: 20px;"><font size="5"><font face="Aptos, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" style="font-family: Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">science is remiss if it fails to </span></font><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" style=""><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">interrogate</span></font><font style=""><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" style="font-family:Aptos, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"> the
nature and power of </span></font><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">“</span><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><font face="Aptos, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">faith</span></font><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">”</span>,
given our embodied capacities for anomalous or “spiritual" experiences</font></font></font></blockquote><div style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;">i'm an atheist. when science first grabbed hold of my soul when i was ten years old, its aspiration to me seemed to be omniscience.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;">spiritual experiences are real. they may not be manifestations of god, especially to folks like me to whom there is no god. so what the hell are they? where do they come from? how did they evolve? what do they mean? what do they tell us about the nature of the cosmos that has birthed them?</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;">in my fieldwork in mass behavior, working with people like michael jackson and prince for 20 years, i saw collective ecstasies, what emil durkheim called "collective effervescence," ecstatic experiences at work in audiences all over north america.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;">in fact, one of the jobs of my entertainers was to reliably evoke these transcendent experiences. and in building the careers of people like Prince, it was my job to help deliver these ecstasies. they are real.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;">if science can't address the question of these experiences, it abandons the aspiration to omniscience. and it's not science.</div></div><div style="font-size: 24px;"></div>
<div style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false" style="font-size: 24px;"><span>with warmth and oomph--howard</span><br></div><div style="font-size: 24px;"><br></div>
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On Monday, March 10, 2025 at 07:49:34 PM EDT, Katherine Peil <ktpeil@outlook.com> wrote:
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<span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">Hello All,</span></div>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">The discussion about </span></font><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">“</span></font><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">nothing"
or “something" being exchanged between speakers and listeners prompts this </span><span></span></font><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">question: What about the phenomenon of "emotional contagion”? Do Mike Levin’s revelation about bioelectricity
bear upon the concept of “subtle energy”?</font></div>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Aptos, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="3" style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">Also, science is remiss if it fails to </span></font><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">interrogate</span></font><font size="3"><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" style="font-family:Aptos, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"> the
nature and power of </span></font><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">“</span><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><font face="Aptos, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">faith</span></font><span style="font-family:Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">”</span>,
given our embodied capacities for anomalous or “spiritual" experiences. Pre-emptive pejoratives are not good science, but they abound.</font></font></div>
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<font size="3"><font face="Avenir, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">Kate Kauffman</font></font></div>
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