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<p>Dear Kate,</p>
<p>A bit late, but some brief reactions. <br>
</p>
<p>Most emotions don't seem to be binary. They drive us and
influence our perception, thought, intentions and execution of our
strategies. They even cover what we think is our capacity to act
in world. Emotions are much more than run or attack. There are so
many subtle mixtures of love and hate, of liking and not liking,
of trepidation and courage. </p>
<p>Emotions are involved in the construction of what is perceived
and thought to be possible. </p>
<p>-Eric <br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/7/24 11:02 PM, Katherine Peil
wrote:<br>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif">Hi
Peter,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif">I’ve
only been able to pop in occasionally, but I find your
thoughts on feedback to be highly relevant to many of the
big open questions. Not only “information” but agency,
cognition, creativity and the structure of “identity” itself
(something that our best hard science theory does not
address.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif"><br>
At the beginning of the year, I led a discussion herein
where I suggested that the
<i>emotional system</i> was central to our “self-regulatory”
hardware (genetic, epigenetic and immune regulation). In
this view, binary feelings (pleasurable or painful, eustress
or distress) serve as cybernetic feedback signals –
informative software - that originate in the
non-equilibrium dynamics of complex adaptive systems (those
that must constantly exchange energy and resources with
their local environment in order to exist). I cited a four
step cybernetic control loop instantiated by a coupling
between bottom up positive (amplifying) feedback and
top-down negative (homeostatic) feedback that works like
this: 1) An ongoing
<i>comparison</i> is made between internal and external
environments; 2) A <i>signal</i> is sent when self-relevant
mismatches occur; which 3) triggers a coupled
<i>self-correcting response</i>, which is then 4) <i>fed
back</i> as a memory into the next cycle “comparison”. (AI
uses a similar arrangement for deep neural learning
networks, by comparing two probability distributions that
compare internal requirements and external circumstances,
modelling mismatches as free energy – “surprises” to the
system - wherein learning occurs the via the goal of
reducing free energy.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif">But
as living systems, we have direct experience of a binary
feedback signal as emotional sensory qualia –
self-regulatory surprises that come in feel-good or feel-bad
categories and are coupled to approach or avoidant
self-correcting behavioral responses. I call these binary
qualia the
<i>fundamental semantic information bit, </i>for their
binary categories drive each step in the loop and set the
stage for all Pavlovian learning.<br>
<br>
This loop, and its subjective binary hedonic driver, is
central to the operational, organizational and informational
closure of complex self-organizing and autopoietic systems,
and it is central to the ongoing construction of the
enactive “mind”. It enables an identity structure that
behaves as a dance of both parts and wholes, an autonomous
yet collective agent, both determined yet with minor
participation, in ways that mediate both being and becoming.
And so much more…<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif">Sorry
for the quick core dump, but I thought I’d pop in to applaud
Peter’s inquiry and say hi to you all!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif">Katherine
Kauffman<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif">(Kung
Fu Kate)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Avenir Next",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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style="color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="color:black">Fis
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<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, November 6, 2024 at 7:40 PM<br>
<b>To: </b><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es">fis@listas.unizar.es</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es"><fis@listas.unizar.es></a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Fis Digest, Vol 116, Issue 8<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: Fwd: Re: New Discussion
Session--Complexity & feedback<br>
(Peter Erdi)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2024 02:39:45 +0000<br>
From: Peter Erdi <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Peter.Erdi@kzoo.edu"><Peter.Erdi@kzoo.edu></a><br>
To: Pedro C. Mariju?n
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:pedroc.marijuan@gmail.com"><pedroc.marijuan@gmail.com></a>,<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es">"fis@listas.unizar.es"</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es"><fis@listas.unizar.es></a><br>
Subject: Re: [Fis] Fwd: Re: New Discussion
Session--Complexity &<br>
feedback<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:BY5PR12MB39852EDD96A4B026324DCA5EF35C2@BY5PR12MB3985.namprd12.prod.outlook.com"><BY5PR12MB39852EDD96A4B026324DCA5EF35C2@BY5PR12MB3985.namprd12.prod.outlook.com></a><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"<br>
<br>
Thank you, Pedro, for your thoughtful post. I hope
some people will react, and we will kick the ball
towards some goal. Alternatively, the discussion
might evolve by random mutations.<br>
<br>
By the way, Gordana and Sheri: more thoughts about
the relationship between cybernetics and complex
systems theory with evolution?<br>
<br>
Peter<br>
________________________________<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
<i>
Dr. Eric Werner, FLS <br>
Oxford Advanced Research Foundation <br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://oarf.org__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!R-Gi37vuYLoUksqZFW0zHvoDcMrSEa9O7hXZuPDmD02RM8Q1aJhZ0z9PSXhDtRXoYNBYNRsPyBzQpvb5NZrIzJ0$">https://oarf.org</a> <br>
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