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<div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">michael levin has written of "competency architectures."</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">in my book Global Brain, i chose another name for these natural learning machines, "complex adaptive systems." </div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">here's a bit on the topic from Global Brain: the Evolution of Mass Mind from the Big Bang to the Twentieth Century:</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div></div><blockquote style="margin: 0 0 0 40px; border: none; padding: 0px;"><div class="ydp53d37520yahoo-style-wrap" style="font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:24px;"><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;mso-fareast-font-family:Times New Roman;letter-spacing:-.15pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-bidi-language:AR-SA">A complex adaptive system is a learning machine, one
made up of semi-independent modules which work together to solve a
problem.<span> </span>Some complex adaptive systems,
like rain forests, are biological.<span>
</span>Others, like human economies, are social.<span> </span>And the ones computer scientists work with
are usually electronic.<span> </span>Neural networks</span>[i]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;mso-fareast-font-family:Times New Roman;letter-spacing:-.15pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-bidi-language:AR-SA"> and immune systems</span>[ii]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;mso-fareast-font-family:Times New Roman;letter-spacing:-.15pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-bidi-language:AR-SA"> are particularly
good examples.<span> </span>Both apply an algorithm--a
working rule--best expressed by Jesus of Nazareth: "To he who hath it
shall be given; from he who hath not even what he hath shall be taken
away."</span>[iii]
</span></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">a
collective learning machine achieves its feats by using five elements.<span> </span>This quintet of essentials includes: (1)
conformity enforcers; (2) diversity generators; (3) inner-judges; (4) resource
shifters; and (5) intergroup tournaments.</span>[i]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"></span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 1in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>•<b>Conformity
enforcers</b> stamp enough cookie cutter similarities into the members of a
group to give it an identity, to unify it when it's pelted by adversity, to
make sure its members speak a common language, and to pull the crowd together
in efforts sometimes so vast that no single contributor can see the larger
scheme in its entirety.</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 1in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>In
humans, upcoming chapters will show how conformity enforcers lead, among other
things, to a myriad of cruelties and to a shared worldview which both shapes
the wiring of a baby's brain and literally changes the way that adults see, a
collective perception which makes one group's reality another's mass insanity.</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 1in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>•<b>Diversity
generators</b> spawn variety.<span> </span>Each
individual represents a hypothesis in the communal mind.<span> </span>You can see this in one of nature's most
superb learning machines, the immune system.<span>
</span>The immune system contains between ten million and ten billion different
antibody types.<span> </span>Each one is a guess,
pre-configured to snag the weak points of an enemy.</span>[ii]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>If one antibody
isn't properly shaped to lock onto an invader, another will have to sink its
specialized hooks into the raider.<span> </span>It's
vital for defensive flexibility to have numerous fallback antibodies on the
scene. So the immune system maintains a horde of seemingly-useless types in its
population, though it keeps these idlers in a state of deprivation.<span> </span>When a previously unknown disease storms the
body's barricades, the immune system's pool of misfits often contains a few
individuals with exactly what it takes to trounce the foe.<span> </span>Among human beings, different personality
types also embody approaches which, while they may not be necessary today, could
prove vital tomorrow.<span> </span>As we move past
the ice age toward modernity, we'll see how odd-folks-out have often
supercharged our history.</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 1in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>•Next
come <b>inner-judges</b>.<span> </span>Inner-judges
are biological built-ins</span>[iii]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> which continually take our measure, rewarding us when
our contribution seems to be of value</span>[iv]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> and punishing us when our guesswork proves unwelcome or
way off the mark.<span> </span>If we've solved a
knotty problem and can hear the cheers of bosses, friends, family, and admirers
echoing in our ears, our inner-judges flood us with hormones similar to amphetamine
and cocaine.<span> </span>These chemicals swell our
chests, give us energy, and set our minds ablaze. Zest and confidence help us
see new ways to achieve impossibilities.<span>
</span>On the other hand, if we can't get a grip on our problems and no one
seems to want what we're offering, the inner-judges activate our self-destruct
machinery.</span>[v]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> Our bodies overdose on stress hormones, kill off brain
cells,</span>[vi]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> dull our wits,</span>[vii]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> sabotage our immune system, make us ill, depress us,
steal our pep,</span>[viii]<span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> and often fill our minds with an urge to curl up and
disappear or die. Our inner judges are sometimes generous, but are often far
from kind.<span> </span>Yet inner-judges are critical
to complex adaptive systems from those of single-celled creatures to those made
up of human minds.</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 1in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>•Fourth
are <b>resource shifters</b>.<span> </span>Resource
shifters range from social systems to mass emotions, but all have one thing in
common--they shunt riches, admiration, and influence to learning-machine
members who cruise through challenges and give folks what they want. Meanwhile
resource shifters cast individuals who can't get a handle on what's going on
into some equivalent of pennilessness and unpopularity.<span> </span>Jesus captured the resource shifters'
algorithm--its working rule--when he said, "to he who hath it shall be
given; from he who hath not, even what he hath shall be taken away."</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 1in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span>•Bringing
up the rear are <b>intergroup tournaments</b>, gang wars ranging from the
Lilliputian to the gargantuan, from friendly baseball games and corporate
competition to terrorist raids and nuclear confrontation, face-offs which force
each collective intelligence, each group brain, to churn out innovations for
the fun of winning or for sheer survival's sake.<span> </span></span></p>
<div style="text-align:justify;mso-line-height-alt:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> <span>with warmth and oomph--howard</span></span></div>
<div><!--[if !supportEndnotes]--><br clear="all">
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<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[i]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. Howard Bloom. "Beyond
the Supercomputer: Social Groups as</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">Self-invention Machines."<span> </span>In <i>Research in Biopolitics, vol. 6.: Sociobiology
and Biopolitics</i>. Greenwich, CT: JAI Press Inc., 1998: 43-63.</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn2">
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[ii]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.<span> </span>Doyne Farmer, Alan Lapedes, Norman Packard
and Burton Wendroff, editors. <i>Evolution, Games and Learning: Models for
Adaptation in Machines and Nature, Proceedings of the Fifth Annual International
Conference of the Center for Nonlinear Studies</i>,<i> Los Alamos, NM 87545.
USA, May 20-24, 1985</i>. Amsterdam: North-Holland Physics Publishing, 1985:
188.</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn3">
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[iii]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. Inner-judges of many kinds
show up in the brain and body.<span> </span>The work
of Neil Greenberg indicates that one key location is the striatum. (Neil
Greenberg, Enrique Font, Robert C. Switzer III. "The Reptilian Striatum
Revisited: Studies on <i>Anolis</i> Lizards."<span> </span>In <i>The Forebrain of Reptiles: Current
Concepts of Structure and Function</i>, edited by Walter K Schwerdtfeger and
Willhelmus J.A.J. Smeets. Basel: Karger, 1988: 162-177.) The striatum can wreak
havoc on such basic things as our ability to translate thought into movement
and our capacity to dampen the pain of stress.<span>
</span>Greenberg also points to another inner-judge, one which lowers our
sexuality. (Neil Greenberg. Personal communication, June 20, 1998.)</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"> </span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn4">
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[iv]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. For one example, see: Myron
F. Floyd. "Pleasure, arousal, and dominance: Exploring affective
determinants of recreation satisfaction." <i>Leisure Sciences</i>,
April-June, 1997: 83-96.</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn5">
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[v]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. In neural net terms, these
would be referred to as mechanisms for "self-inhibition." (T. Fukai,
S. Tanaka. "A simple neural network exhibiting selective activation of
neuronal ensembles: from winner-take-all to winners-share-all." <i>Neural
Computation</i>, January 1997: 77-97.)</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn6">
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[vi]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. B.S. McEwen.
"Corticosteroids and hippocampal plasticity."</span></p>
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt"><span> </span><i>Brain
Corticosteroid Receptors: Studies on the Mechanism, Function, and Neurotoxicity
of Corticosteroid Action,</i> Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences, 746,
November 30, 1994: 142‑4, 178‑9; L.P. Reagan, B.S. McEwen. "Controversies
surrounding glucocorticoid‑mediated cell death in the hippocampus."<span> </span><i>Journal of Chemical Neuroanatomy</i>,
August 1997: 149‑67.</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn7">
<p class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[vii]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. Not only do the inner-judges
dull our wits by decreasing brain circulation, they also give us headaches.
(Roy J. Mathew, W.H. Wilson. "Intracranial and extracranial blood flow
during acute anxiety." <i>Psychiatry Research</i>, May 16, 1997: 93‑107.)</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydp6b715915edn8">
<div style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[viii]<span class="ydp6b715915MsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. R.J. Mathew, A.A. Swihart,
M.L. Weinman. "Vegetative symptoms in anxiety and depression."<span> </span><i>British Journal of Psychiatry</i>, August
1982: 162‑5; Klaus Atzwanger and Alain Schmitt. "Walking Speed and
Depression: Are Sad Pedestrians Slow?" <i>Human Ethology Bulletin</i>, 3
Sept 1997.</span></div>
</div>
</div></div></div></blockquote><div class="ydp53d37520yahoo-style-wrap" style="font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:24px;"><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><span><div><!--[if !supportEndnotes]--><br clear="all">
<hr align="left" size="1" width="33%">
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<div id="ydpf3c4cb7bedn1">
<p class="ydpf3c4cb7bMsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[i]<span class="ydpf3c4cb7bMsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. J.C. Parikh, B. Pratap.
"An evolutionary model of a neural network."<span> </span><i>Journal of Theoretical Biology</i>, May 7,
1984: 31-8; J.J.<span> </span>Hopfield. "Neural
networks and physical systems with emergent<span>
</span>collective computational<span>
</span>abilities."<span> </span><i>Proceedings
of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America</i>, April
1982: 2554-8.</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydpf3c4cb7bedn2">
<p class="ydpf3c4cb7bMsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[ii]<span class="ydpf3c4cb7bMsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. J.D. Farmer, S.A. Kauffman,
N.H. Packard and A.S. Perelson. "Adaptive Dynamic Networks as Models for
the Immune System and Autocatalytic Sets." In <i>Perspectives in
Biological Dynamics and Theoretical Medicine</i>, edited by S.H. Koslow, A.J.
Mandell, and M.F. Shlesinger. New York: New York Academy of Sciences, 1987:
118-131.</span></p>
</div>
<div id="ydpf3c4cb7bedn3">
<p class="ydpf3c4cb7bMsoEndnoteText" style="text-align:justify;line-height:12.0pt;mso-hyphenate:none;tab-stops:0in">[iii]<span class="ydpf3c4cb7bMsoEndnoteReference"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">.</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Times New Roman,serif;letter-spacing:-.15pt">. Mark 4:25</span></p>
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</div><div id="ydpf1d481feyahoo_quoted_4325854149" class="ydpf1d481feyahoo_quoted">
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On Saturday, April 27, 2024 at 07:55:10 PM EDT, Levin, Michael <michael.levin@allencenter.tufts.edu> wrote:
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<div><div dir="ltr">Hi Aaron,<br clear="none"><br clear="none">> but seriously incomplete, in my view,<br clear="none"><br clear="none"> Absolutely; if this was complete, we could all go home and all of biomedicine would be solved :-) certainly it is incomplete. I have focused on some specific issues and ignored many others, as the field is vast.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">> As far as I know Levin has not mentioned or offered explanations for the<br clear="none">phenomena I've mentioned (and there's much more that I haven't mentioned). I've<br clear="none">written to him about this. <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> correct; I have nothing much to say about innate behavioral competencies of specific animals. But I view them as not more impressive than innate competencies of cells and various embryos in anatomical and physiological spaces - to me, the problem-solving strategies they deploy natively - "out of the box" - are of exactly the same type as the behavioral ones you emphasize. It is behavior, even though in other spaces besides our familiar 3D space, and complex problem-solving behavior at that. So, I think in working on the origin of that, we are addressing fundamentally the question you are asking: where do behavioral competencies, in whatever space, come from. We do have answers to some of that, although - absolutely, incomplete!<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Best,<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Mike<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">-----Original Message-----<br clear="none">From: Fis <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es</a> <mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es>> on behalf of "a.sloman@bham.ac.uk <mailto:a.sloman@bham.ac.uk>" <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:a.sloman@bham.ac.uk" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">a.sloman@bham.ac.uk</a> <mailto:a.sloman@bham.ac.uk>><br clear="none">Reply-To: "a.sloman@bham.ac.uk <mailto:a.sloman@bham.ac.uk>" <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:a.sloman@bham.ac.uk" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">a.sloman@bham.ac.uk</a> <mailto:a.sloman@bham.ac.uk>><br clear="none">Date: Saturday, April 27, 2024 at 7:56 AM<br clear="none">To: "Gordana Dodig-Crnkovic <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:gordana.dodig-crnkovic@mdu.se" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">gordana.dodig-crnkovic@mdu.se</a> <mailto:gordana.dodig-crnkovic@mdu.se>> 'fis'" <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">fis@listas.unizar.es</a> <mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es>><br clear="none">Subject: [External] [Fis] Tao and information processing (for a human): Fwd: Re: Emotional Sentience #2 The Metaphor of The Tao (the last long post!)<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Dear Gordana (and Fis),<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I apologise for the format of this message if anyone finds it difficult. I find<br clear="none">it very difficult to cope with the format of the Fis messages, which I have to<br clear="none">transform radically in order to be able to reply quoting parts, in the ancient<br clear="none">programmable text editor (part of Poplog) which I use on Linux for reading and<br clear="none">writing messages and other work, e.g. developing web sites.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I apologise for any errors or obscurities introduced by my re-formatting of<br clear="none">Gordana's text.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I am responding to the message in which she wrote:<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">> Dear Joseph<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> Let me comment on the following statement in your mail:<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> > You also introduce computability in an area where non-computability - the<br clear="none">> > absence of an algorithm - perhaps predominates.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> Allow me to disagree.<br clear="none">> Algorithm is not what it used to be -- the Turing Machine. Our late colleague,<br clear="none">> mathematician Mark Burgin has written extensively on that topic.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> I suppose you refer to this passage in Kate's mail:<br clear="none">> "wherein the ongoing cyclic transitions between them form the computational<br clear="none">> engine of The Tao. This dance delivers the algorithmic logic of Turing machines,<br clear="none">> and the opponent processes, metastability and regulatory switching, evident in<br clear="none">> metabolism, morphogenesis, genetic and the autonomic neural networks embody<br clear="none">> behavioral control."<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> There is a way to represent all natural processes as computation -- natural<br clear="none">> computation, natural information processing.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> If we look at the physiological (bio-chemical) processes underlying emotions,<br clear="none">> feelings, and other sub-symbolic processes in the human body, all of them can be<br clear="none">> represented as information processes.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I have very recently taken that last idea much further and argued that the<br clear="none">oldest and most important forms of information processing in animals on this<br clear="none">planet are located in synapses, which are descendants of the most most ancient<br clear="none">ancestors of animals, including humans: single celled organisms, which later<br clear="none">evolved to the sexually reproducing single-celled organisms discussed by Tibor<br clear="none">Ganti in his book The Principles of Life, referenced in the huge, unfinished,<br clear="none">online document in which I am developing these ideas, referring to a vast, and<br clear="none">steadily increasing number of other sources:<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/research/projects/cogaff/misc/metamorphosis.html__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqvuMG5UA$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/research/projects/cogaff/misc/metamorphosis.html__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqvuMG5UA$</a> <<a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/research/projects/cogaff/misc/metamorphosis.html__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqvuMG5UA$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/research/projects/cogaff/misc/metamorphosis.html__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqvuMG5UA$</a>><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">(search in it for "Ganti" for references to his work and to commentaries on it.)<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">My claim (strongly influenced by the work of Seth Grant and colleagues in<br clear="none">Edinburgh University -- also referenced in that document, whose ideas I have<br clear="none">extended) is that the most powerful forms of information processing used in<br clear="none">cognition in animals, including humans, occur in synapses, with neurons having<br clear="none">important but subsidiary roles, including transferring information between<br clear="none">synapses and other, more recently evolved, parts of animal bodies. There are<br clear="none">also other forms of communication and control, e.g. using hormones transmitted<br clear="none">via blood vessels.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Gordana wrote:<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">> Michael Levin and collaborators have practical applications in their work in<br clear="none">> biology and medicine. <a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://drmichaellevin.org/__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqJ6BmNk8$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://drmichaellevin.org/__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqJ6BmNk8$</a> <<a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://drmichaellevin.org/__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqJ6BmNk8$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://drmichaellevin.org/__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqJ6BmNk8$</a>><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">That is important and impressive work, but seriously incomplete, in my view,<br clear="none">e.g. ignoring processes that have evolved in branching trajectories in species<br clear="none">that reproduce by laying eggs enclosed in shells, and emerge with very complex<br clear="none">physiological structures and significant unlearnt cognitive competences, e.g.<br clear="none">many species of newly hatched birds and reptiles, including sea-turtles emerging<br clear="none">from eggs buried in sand and abandoned by their mothers.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">As far as I know Levin has not mentioned or offered explanations for the<br clear="none">phenomena I've mentioned (and there's much more that I haven't mentioned). I've<br clear="none">written to him about this. He has also heard me give presentations on some of<br clear="none">the ideas, but not the most recent ones mentioned below.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I have not been using the word "algorithm" in connection with the biological<br clear="none">information processing mechanisms. Instead I talk about varieties of information<br clear="none">processing, especially processing of information during control of complex<br clear="none">biochemical processes of reproduction and development, and most recently in my<br clear="none">discussions of metamorphosis, involving very complex chemical decomposition and<br clear="none">recombination processes -- arguably more sophisticated than anything prodced by<br clear="none">human engineers, all happening in very small spaces with small temperature<br clear="none">changes and using small amounts of energy.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">No human designed assembly mechanisms that I know of come close to matching<br clear="none">those features.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I am grateful for pointers to relevant published work (preferably freely<br clear="none">available online) that sould be referenced in the metamorphosis.html document<br clear="none">The name of the document is misleading though I think any other short name would<br clear="none">also be misleading. In a sense, the name of the document is partly justified by<br clear="none">the non-biological metamorphosis constantly occurring in the document as I<br clear="none">work on it!<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">More from Gordana:<br clear="none">(Replying to Joe Brenner)<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">> More about natural computing:<br clear="none">> <a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_computing__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqR5mljTs$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_computing__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqR5mljTs$</a> <<a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_computing__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqR5mljTs$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_computing__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqR5mljTs$</a>><br clear="none">><br clear="none">> A basic book: G.Rozenberg, T.Back, J.Kok, Ed., Handbook of Natural Computing,<br clear="none">> Springer Verlag, 2012<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> <a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://link.springer.com/referencework/10.1007/978-3-540-92910-9__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqDvbUgn8$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://link.springer.com/referencework/10.1007/978-3-540-92910-9__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqDvbUgn8$</a> <<a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://link.springer.com/referencework/10.1007/978-3-540-92910-9__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqDvbUgn8$" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://link.springer.com/referencework/10.1007/978-3-540-92910-9__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznqDvbUgn8$</a>><br clear="none">><br clear="none">> The question if The Tao can be *completely* captured computationally is<br clear="none">> outside the scope of this discussion.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> A photograph cannot completely represent every aspect of its object but is still<br clear="none">> representative enough for a human observer.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Our current ideas about computation now seem to me to form a subset of a larger<br clear="none">collection of ideas about forms of control using huge amounts of information<br clear="none">produced over millions of years, also using surprisingly little energy and very<br clear="none">small but very complex forms of matter.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I hope my departure from the Fis format has not caused any problems.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Aaron<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Aaron Sloman,<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/</a> <<a shape="rect" href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/</a>>*axs__;fg!!D9dNQwwGXtA!W9gRYRrieeHk1y3RNgVHAZrWsk0M_Zii_NwPkNwh0nzzleU7DIlpri6-rcD9Ad6rWw9XM6QSmhjuiznq2Et8dy0$<br clear="none">Emeritus Professor of Artificial Intelligence and Cognitive Science<br clear="none">(Retired, but still working full time, on the Meta-Morphogenesis project,<br clear="none">while brain slides downhill)<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">School of Computer Science,<br clear="none">The University of Birmingham<br clear="none">Edgbaston<br clear="none">Birmingham B15 2TT UK<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Fis mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="mailto:Fis@listas.unizar.es" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Fis@listas.unizar.es</a> <mailto:Fis@listas.unizar.es><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis" rel="nofollow" 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Please exercise caution when clicking links or opening attachments. When in doubt, email the TTS Service Desk at <a shape="rect" href="mailto:it@tufts.edu" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">it@tufts.edu</a> <mailto:it@tufts.edu><mailto:it@tufts.edu <mailto:it@tufts.edu>> or call them directly at 617-627-3376.<div class="ydpf1d481feyqt7458136907" id="ydpf1d481feyqtfd37447" dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Fis mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="mailto:Fis@listas.unizar.es" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Fis@listas.unizar.es</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis</a><br clear="none">----------<br clear="none">INFORMACIN SOBRE PROTECCIN DE DATOS DE CARCTER PERSONAL<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Ud. recibe este correo por pertenecer a una lista de correo gestionada por la Universidad de Zaragoza.<br clear="none">Puede encontrar toda la informacin sobre como tratamos sus datos en el siguiente enlace: <a shape="rect" href="https://sicuz.unizar.es/informacion-sobre-proteccion-de-datos-de-caracter-personal-en-listas" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://sicuz.unizar.es/informacion-sobre-proteccion-de-datos-de-caracter-personal-en-listas</a><br clear="none">Recuerde que si est suscrito a una lista voluntaria Ud. puede darse de baja desde la propia aplicacin en el momento en que lo desee.<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://listas.unizar.es" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://listas.unizar.es</a><br clear="none">----------<div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>__________________________</div><div>Howard Bloom</div><div>Howardbloom.net</div><div><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.howardbloom.institute__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!Qa_JsVEoEPVWZfx27yZxTMsm-7tSIBBQY6tDM8sq4ZB8RV9X7oolyOZPgBrFMFPo5Dz9t4XFZZPcXmHYsA$">www.howardbloom.institute</a></div><div>BRIC-TV's 66-minute film, The Grand Unified Theory of Howard Bloom, <a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atYmiEZ6YDU__;!!D9dNQwwGXtA!Qa_JsVEoEPVWZfx27yZxTMsm-7tSIBBQY6tDM8sq4ZB8RV9X7oolyOZPgBrFMFPo5Dz9t4XFZZML23bUgA$">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atYmiEZ6YDU</a></div><div>Best Picture, Science Design Film Festival. Best Documentary Feature, Not Film Festival, Italy. Available on Apple TV, Amazon, Google Play, Microsoft, Vimeo, Vudu, and Fandango.</div><div><br></div><div>Author of: The Lucifer Principle: A Scientific Expedition Into the Forces of History ("mesmerizing"-The Washington Post), </div><div>Global Brain: The Evolution of Mass Mind From The Big Bang to the 21st Century ("reassuring and sobering"-The New Yorker),</div><div>The Genius of the Beast: A Radical Re-Vision of Capitalism ("A tremendously enjoyable book." James Fallows, National Correspondent, The Atlantic), </div><div>The God Problem: How A Godless Cosmos Creates ("Bloom's argument will rock your world." Barbara Ehrenreich),</div><div>How I Accidentally Started the Sixties (“Wow! Whew! Wild! Wonderful!” Timothy Leary),</div><div>The Mohammed Code (“A terrifying book…the best book I’ve read on Islam.” David Swindle, PJ Media), and</div><div>Einstein, Michael Jackson & Me: a Search for Soul in the Power Pits of Rock & Roll ("Amazing. The writing is revelatory." Freddy DeMann, manager of Michael Jackson and Madonna), Best Book of 2020, New York Weekly Times.</div><div>A Quartz Magazine Pro</div><div>Former Visiting Scholar, Graduate Psychology Department, New York University, Former Core Faculty Member, The Graduate Institute; Current Kepler Space University Professor of Practice.</div><div>Founder: International Paleopsychology Project. Founder, Space Development Steering Committee. Member Of Board Of Governors, National Space Society. Founding Board Member: Epic of Evolution Society. Founding Board Member, The Darwin Project.</div></div><br clear="none"></div></div></div>
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