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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=JA link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'>Sunday, June 19, 2022 1:34 AM, <a href="mailto:joe.brenner@bluewin.ch">joe.brenner@bluewin.ch</a> wrote;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'>></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> I believe we may consider an area of science in which a dynamics of simultaneous actuality-potentiality provides the necessary macroscopic explanations, in which the processes involved are nevertheless <i>quantum-like,</i></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'> Quantum Mechanics is peculiar in allowing for both symbolic and indexical languages as demonstrated in the non-commutability of some indexical operations. Likewise, such concurrent participation of the both types of languages remains wide open even to various macroscopic disciplines without referring to QM directly. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'> Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'> Koichiro<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'> Fis <</span><span lang=EN-US><a href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>> <b>On Behalf Of </b></span><span lang=EN-US><a href="mailto:joe.brenner@bluewin.ch"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>joe.brenner@bluewin.ch</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'><br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, June 19, 2022 1:34 AM<br><b>To:</b> 'Andrei Igamberdiev' <</span><span lang=EN-US><a href="mailto:a_igamberdiev@hotmail.com"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>a_igamberdiev@hotmail.com</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>>; 'Stanley N Salthe' <</span><span lang=EN-US><a href="mailto:ssalthe@binghamton.edu"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>ssalthe@binghamton.edu</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>>; 'fis' <</span><span lang=EN-US><a href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>fis@listas.unizar.es</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>>; 'Gordana Dodig Crnkovic' <</span><span lang=EN-US><a href="mailto:gordana.dodig-crnkovic@chalmers.se"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>gordana.dodig-crnkovic@chalmers.se</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:JA'>><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fis] [External Email] Re: Biological computation session - Kickoff Text. Comment<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Dear Gordana, Andrei, Nikita, Stan, and All, </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>If I may, I would like to offer a brief summary of that part of the current discussion dealing with aspects of potentiality, with many thanks. The for me central issues were implied in the following, all on June 17:<o:p></o:p></span></p><ol style='margin-top:0mm' start=1 type=1><li class=MsoNormal style='line-height:105%;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Andrei: <o:p></o:p></span></li></ol><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;mso-add-space:auto;line-height:105%'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>The potential field of the internal quantum state implies the simultaneous existence of contradictory statements (JEB: antagonistic phenomena?)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;mso-add-space:auto;line-height:105%'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>The realization of Joseph’s approach, not only philosophically, but from the point of view of natural science, <i>require certain structures that can hold potentiality.</i> <o:p></o:p></span></p><ol style='margin-top:0mm' start=2 type=1><li class=MsoNormal style='line-height:105%;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Stan: What happens to your statement if the quantum idea is removed?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='line-height:105%;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Andrei: I don’t see another way of explaining how a system holds a coherent state for a prolonged time, without applying a theory that deals with the transition between the potential and the actual. If the quantum idea is removed, then we remove any possible explanations of the internal determination of biological activity and the problem of self.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='line-height:105%;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Stan:<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;mso-add-space:auto;line-height:105%'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>So then a QM interpretation would be validated as being ‘about’ something real in an aspect of actual nature (here a living cell) by way of constructing compatibility with a microscopic perspective derived from conventional microscopic science?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>It is quite a remarkable experience for me to see these ideas juxtaposed, finally discussed although certainly not in final form. I believe we may consider an area of science in which a dynamics of simultaneous actuality-potentiality provides the necessary macroscopic explanations, in which the processes involved are nevertheless <i>quantum-like. </i>I would call this an <i>unconventional </i>interpretation of standard science.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>If I take the example of intersubjectivity, we may thus consider here a non-quantum concept for its grounding solely in the macroscopic interactions described.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Best, <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Joseph<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:游ゴシック;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:JA'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0mm 0mm 0mm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0mm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0mm 0mm 0mm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0mm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US>----------<o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></body></html>