<font size="3">Dear Mariusz, Dear Daniel,</font><div><font size="3"><br></font></div><div><font size="3">Please allow me to enter the discussion at this point. I will go back to the beginning as necessary later. I am in general agreement with Mariusz' approach, but I believe it could be strengthened by looking at the potential as well as the actual aspects of the phenomena in question. Thus when Mariusz writes </font><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">interaction, is a prior concept to the concept of being, because without interaction there is no being. It follows that the basic ingredient of being must be two objects/elements/components (forming a contrast) that have common and differentiating features.").</span><span style="font-size: medium;"> , I would add the dimension of becoming, which is a more dynamic relation. We can more easily talk about processes and change instead of component objects</span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;">A similar comment could be made about the discrete-continuous distinction. This is at the same time also an appearance-reality duality which is not static, but embodies the change from actual to potential and vice versa just mentioned.</span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;">I do not, however, agree with the following statement: </span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Besides it is already known that using binary structures it is possible to simulate any processes and objects of reality)</span><span style="font-size: medium;"> There are many non-computable process aspects of reality that cannot be captured and simulated by an algorithm without loss of information and meaning. In the "graph" of the movement of a process from actuality to potentiality, the limiting points of 0 and 1 are not included - it is non-Kolmogorovian.</span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;">I would say regarding beauty that it is a property emerging from the various contrast or antagonisms in the mind/body of the artist. </span><span style="font-size: medium;">The logic of such processes as I have remarked is a logic of energy, and this seems to fit here.</span></div><div><br></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;">Thank you and best wishes,</span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;">Joseph</span></div><div><span style="font-size: medium;"><br></span></div><div><blockquote style="margin-right: 0px; margin-left:15px;">----Message d'origine----<br>De : stanowskimariusz@wp.pl<br>Date : 10/04/2022 - 08:35 (CEST)<br>À : daniel.boyd@live.nl, fis@listas.unizar.es<br>Objet : Re: [Fis] Book Presentation<br><br><div class="moz-cite-prefix">
Dear Daniel,
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Thank you for your questions. Below are the highlighted answers (of course they are more complete in the book).
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Mariusz
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W dniu 2022-04-09 o 17:37, Daniel Boyd pisze:
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">Dear Mariusz
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">While (or perhaps because!) your work is a fair distance from my own field of expertise, I found your conceptual framework intriguing. Herewith some of the thoughts it elicited. While they may be unexpected because they come from a different angle, hopefully a cross-disciplinary interaction will be fruitful.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">The Second Law of Thermodynamics dictates the ultimate heat death of the universe (a state in which all 'contrasts' are erased). <font color="#ff0000">(The heat death of the universe is just a popular view and not a scientific truth)</font></span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;"><font color="#ff0000"></font>Its current state, fortunately for us, is teeming with differences (between entities, properties and interactions) which underlie all that is of importance to us. To take such contrasts as a unifying principle would therefore seem to be undeniable, if extremely ambitious! After all, the sheer diversity of contrasts takes us from the different spins of subatomic particles underlying the various elements to the masses of the celestial bodies determining their orbits around the sun; from the colours in a painting to the sounds of a symphony. Systemically, different patterns of contrasts underlie the distinctions between linear and complex systems. Contrasts also form the basis for the working of our sense organs, the perceptions derived from them, and the inner world of conscious experience. In each of these contexts very different classes of contrasts lead to different mechanisms and laws, leading me to wonder just what the 'underlying structure' is (beyond the observation that, ultimately, some type of contrast is always involved and that we tend to deal with such diverse contrasts in a similar way). Maybe your book provides an answer to this question that I am unable to find in this brief abstract: could you perhaps say something about this? <font color="#ff0000">(The answer to this question is contained in the contrast-being relation: "Contrast-Being Contrast, or interaction, is a prior concept to the concept of being, because without interaction there is no being. It follows that the basic ingredient of being must be two objects/elements/components (forming a contrast) that have common and differentiating features.").</font>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">Moving on to more specific topics, I see that you equate the complexity of a system to a relationship between binary values (</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;">C = N²/n</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">). While such as approach may work for discontinuous contrasts (e.g. presence/absence, information in digital systems) many naturally occurring differences are continuous (e.g. the electromagnetic frequencies underlying the colours of the rainbow). In neuroscience, while the firing of a neuron may be a binary event, the charge underlying this event is a dynamic continuous variable. My question: how does the concept of abstract complexity deal with continuous variables ("contrasts")?<font color="#ff0000"> (What seems to us to be continuous in reality may be discrete, e.g. a picture or a sound on a computer is continuous and in reality it is a binary structure of electric impulses; a continuous color is a vibration of an electromagnetic wave. Besides it is already known that using binary structures it is possible to simulate any processes and objects of reality).
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">I was also intrigued by your statement that "</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;">Beautiful are objects with high information compression</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">" based on the reasoning "</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;">perceiving beauty, we save energy, the perception becomes more economical and pleasant</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">". Intuitively, it seems odd to me to equate beauty to the lack of perceptive effort required.<font color="#ff0000"> (This is not about "no effort" but about "saving effort". If we have a beautiful and an ugly object with the same information content, the perception of the beautiful object will require less energy. The measure of beauty is not the amount of effort/energy, but the amount of energy saved, which in the case of the Sagrada Familia will be greater). </font>This would mean that the Pentagon (high regularity/compressibility) is more beautiful than the Sagrada Familia (low regularity/compressibility); and a single-instrument midi rendition of Bach is more beautiful than a symphonic performance. It seems to me that beauty often stimulates (gives energy) rather than just costing minimal energy. Much research has been done on the universal and culture-dependent perception of beauty: does this support your statement? see e.g. <a href="https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1551-6709.2011.01229.x" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1551-6709.2011.01229.x</a> which describes factors other than simplicity as necessary characteristics. <font color="#ff0000">(This article is based on faulty assumptions e.g. misunderstanding Kolmogorov's definition of complexity, which is not applicable here).</font></span><br></p>
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<td style="border: none;padding: 9.0pt 27.0pt 9.0pt 9.0pt;" valign="top"><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1551-6709.2011.01229.x" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="text-decoration: none;"><img style="width: 1.1458in;height: 1.6666in;" id="_x0000_i1026" src="https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/27d06595-b3bb-4fc6-b149-72a4cd99ef89/cogs.v45.4.cover.jpg" moz-do-not-send="true" width="110" height="160" border="0"></span></a>
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<td style="width: 100.0%;border: none;padding: 9.0pt 27.0pt 9.0pt 9.0pt;" width="100%" valign="top"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 16.0pt;"><a href="https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1551-6709.2011.01229.x" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="text-decoration: none;">Musings About Beauty - Kintsch - 2012 - Cognitive Science - Wiley Online Library</span></a>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">By defining contrast as a distinction between entities or properties, it seems to come close as a definition to the type of information underlying physical entropy. That being the case, your approach would seem to resemble those who would give such information a comparable fundamental significance (e.g. Wheeler's "it from bit"). Could you say something about how you see the relationship between 'contrast' and 'information? Are they effectively synonyms?</span><font color="#ff0000"> Contrast and information are different concepts. Information is a feature or form of energy. Contrast is the tension/force/energy created by the interaction of common features (attraction) and different features (repulsion) of contrasting objects).</font><br></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">Thankyou, in any case, for your contribution which certainly demonstrates the relationship between Value and Development </span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;">😉</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;color: black;">Regards, Daniel Boyd
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="border: none;padding: 0.0cm;"><b>Van: </b><a style="cursor:pointer; text-decoration:underline; color:blue" onclick="javascript:handleMailto('mailto:stanowskimariusz@wp.pl');" moz-do-not-send="true">Mariusz Stanowski</a><br><b>Verzonden: </b>zaterdag 2 april 2022 19:23<br><b>Aan: </b><a style="cursor:pointer; text-decoration:underline; color:blue" onclick="javascript:handleMailto('mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es');" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">fis@listas.unizar.es</a><br><b>Onderwerp: </b>[Fis] Book Presentation</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto;"><b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: PL;" lang="EN-GB">Book Presentation</span></b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto;"><b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">“Theory and Practice of Contrast: Integrating Science, Art and Philosophy.”</span></b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto;"><b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">Mariusz Stanowski</span></b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto;"><b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">Published June 10, 2021 by CRC Press (hardcover and eBook).</span></b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto;"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">Dear FIS list members,</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto;"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">Many thanks for the opportunity to present my recent book in this list.</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;line-height: 150.0%;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;line-height: 150.0%;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;line-height: 150.0%;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">Our dispersed knowledge needs an underlying structure that allows it to be organised into a coherent and complex system.</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;line-height: 150.0%;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent: 35.4pt;line-height: 150.0%;"><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;line-height: 150.0%;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;" lang="EN-GB">I believe “Theory and Practice of Contrast” provides such a structure by bringing the considerations to the most basic, general and abstract level. At this level it is possible to define <b>contrast as a tension between common and differentiating features of objects. It grows in intensity as the number/strength of differentiating and common features of contrasting structures/objects increases</b>. Contrast understood in this way applies to any objects of reality (mental and physical) and is also an impact (causal force) in the most general sense. Contrast as a common principle organises (binds) our knowledge into a coherent system. This is illustrated by a diagram of the connections between the key concepts:</span><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;line-height: 150.0%;font-family: Arial , sans-serif;mso-fareast-language: EN-US;">
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span lang="EN-GB">Contrast—Development </span></b><span lang="EN-GB">When observing a contrast, we also observe the connection between contrasting objects/structures (resulting from their common features) and the emergence of a </span><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">new, more complex structure possessing the common and differentiating features of connected structures. In the general sense, the emergence of a new structure is tantamount to development. Therefore, it may be stated that contrast is a perception of structures/objects connections, or experience of development. The association of contrast with development brings a new quality to the understanding of many other fundamental concepts, such as beauty, value, creativity, emergence. (Similarly, <i>contrast as development </i>is understood in Whitehead’s philosophy).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Contrast—Complexity </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">In accordance with the proposed definition, when we consider the contrast between two or more objects/structures, it grows in intensity as the number/strength of differentiating and common features of contrasting structures/objects increases. Such an understanding of contrast remain an intuitive criterion of complexity that can be formulated as follows: <b>a system becomes more complex the greater is the number of distinguishable elements and the greater the number of connections among them</b><i>. </i>If in definition of contrast we substitute “differentiating features” for “distinguishable elements” and “common features” for “connections”, we will be able to conclude that <b>contrast is the perception and measure of complexity.</b></span></p>
<p class="Default" style="text-indent: 35.4pt;line-height: 150.0%;"><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Note: Two types of contrasts can be distinguished: the sensual (physical) contrast, which is determined only by the force of features of contrasting objects and the mental (abstract) contrast which depends primarily on the number of these features. (This contrast can be equated with complexity). (The equation of contrast with complexity is an important finding for the investigations in: cognitive sciences, psychology, ontology, epistemology, aesthetics, axiology, biology, information theory, complexity theory and indirectly in physics).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Complexity—Information Compression </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Intuition says that the more complex object with the same number of components (e.g. words) has more features/information (i.e. more common and differentiating features), which proves its better organization (assuming that all components have the same or similar complexity). We can also say that such an object has a higher degree of complexity. The degree of complexity is in other words the brevity of the form or the compression of information. Complexity understood intuitively (as above) depends, however, not only on the complexity degree (that could be defined as the ratio of the number of features to the number of components) but also on the (total) number of features, because it is more difficult to organize a larger number of elements/features. In addition, the more features (with the same degree of complexity), the greater the contrast. Therefore, in the proposed <i>Abstract Definition of Complexity </i>(2011), we multiply the degree of complexity by the number of features. This definition defines the complexity (C) of the binary structure (general model of all structures/objects) as the quotient of the square of features (regularities/substructures) number (N) to the number of components or the number of zeros and ones (n). It is expressed in a simple formula: C = N²/n and should be considered the most general definition of complexity, among the existing ones, which also fulfils the intuitive criterion. (This relation explains what compression of information in general is and what role it plays as a complexity factor. This allows to generalize the notion of information compression and use it not only in computer science, but also in other fields of knowledge, such as aesthetics, axiology, cognitive science, biology, chemistry, physics).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Information compression—Development </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Our mind perceiving objects (receiving information) more compressed, saves energy. Compression/organization of information reduce energy of perception while maintaining the same amount of information (in case of lossless compression). Thanks to this, perception becomes easier (more economical) and more enjoyable; for example, it can be compared to faster and easier learning, acquiring knowledge (information), which also contributes to our development. Compression of information as a degree of complexity also affects its size. Complexity, in turn, is a measure of contrast (and vice versa). Contrast, however, is identified with development. Hence, complexity is also development. This sequence of associations is the second way connecting the compression of information with development. Similarly, one can trace all other possibilities of connections in the diagram. (The association of information compression with development brings a new, explanatory knowledge to many fields including cognitive science, aesthetics, axiology, information theory).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Development—Value </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Development is the essence of value, because all values (ethical, material, intellectual, etc.) contribute to our development which is their common feature. It follows that value is also a contrast, complexity and compression of information because they are synonymous with development. (The relation explains and defines the notion of value fundamental to axiology).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Value—Abstract Value </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">About all kinds of values (with the exception of aesthetic values) we can say, what they are useful for. Only aesthetic values can be said to serve the development or be the essence of values, values in general or abstract values. This is a property of abstract concepts to express the general idea of something (e.g. the concept of a chair includes all kinds of chairs and not a specific one). It follows that <b>what is specific to aesthetic value is that it is an abstract value</b> (although it is difficult to imagine). (This is a new understanding of aesthetic value, crucial for aesthetics and axiology).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Contrast—Being </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Contrast or interaction is a concept prior to the concept of being because without interaction there is no existence. It follows that the basic component of being must be two objects/elements/components (creating a contrast) having common and differentiating features. (Understanding of being as a contrast is fundamental to ontology and metaphysics and worth considering in physics).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Contrast—Cognition </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">The object of cognition and the subject (mind) participate in the cognitive process. The object and the subject have common and differentiating features, thus they create a contrast. Cognition consists in attaching (through common features) differentiating features of the object by the subject. In this way, through the contrast, the subject develops. It can therefore be said that cognition is a contrast of the object with the subject. (This is a new definition of cognition important for epistemology and cognitive science).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Cognition—Subjectivity </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">The above understanding of cognition agrees all disputable issues (present, among others, in psychology, cognitive science and aesthetics) regarding the objectivity and subjectivity of assessments (e.g. whether the source of beauty is the observer's mind, whether it is a specific quality from the observer independent), because it shows that they depend on both the subject and the object, i.e. depend on their relationship—contrast.</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Compression of information—Beauty </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Beautiful are objects with high information compression (a large degree of complexity/organization). Thanks to the compression of information, perceiving beauty, we save energy, the perception becomes more economical and pleasant which favours our development and is therefore a value for us. </span><span lang="EN-GB">The example is golden division. </span><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Counting features (information) in all possible types of divisions (asymmetrical, symmetrical and golden) showed that the golden division contains the most features/information (an additional feature is well known golden proportion) and therefore creates the greatest contrast, complexity and aesthetic value. (This explains the previously unknown reasons for aesthetic preferences, key to aesthetics, art theory, psychology, cognitive science and neuroaesthetics).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Development—Beauty </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Beauty contributes to development thanks to the economy of perception. Perception of beauty is accompanied by a sense of development or ease and pleasure of perception. (This explains the causes of aesthetic preferences).</span></p>
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<p class="Default" style="line-height: 150.0%;"><b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Abstract Value—Beauty, Art </span></b><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">Only beauty and art have no specific value but they express/have value in general (an abstract value). The objects that make up a work of art are not important, but their contrast-interaction, which results from the complexity of the artwork. (If we see a single object in the gallery, then the art is its contrast with the context - as in the case of Duchamp's "Urinal" or Malevich's "Black Square"). One can say that beauty and art are distinguished (defined) by two elements: abstract value and a large contrast.</span><span lang="EN-GB"></span><span style="color: windowtext;" lang="EN-GB">(This is a new and only definition of beauty/art that indicates the distinctive common features of all aesthetic/artistic objects, it is crucial for the theory of art, aesthetics, axiology and epistemology).</span></p>
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