<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">Dear Marcus,</div>I am interested in thinking about “DNA Code”. <div class="">Here we have a pattern in nature that can be agreed upon — we have knowledge about how the sequencing of the bases in DNA is used in the operation of<div class="">cells and their replication.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">DNA does not appear to be “code” in the sense that we use the term for coding a message where there is an alternation between meaning and syntax. If you see that 22 has two two’s in it you are examining the syntactical level of 22 and writing out its meaning; you are making an observation about the string 22. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">This sort of translation to a description (and back if we write 22 as an encoding of 22 — I am referring to things like 3#4* as an encoding of ###****) </div><div class="">is not what we see in our observation of the DNA/RNA cellular workings. </div><div class="">What we see is much more tied to contiguity of interaction of the molecules. </div><div class="">We observe already developed molecular machinery doing a variety of jobs. </div><div class="">There is no syntax < —> meaning loop there. </div><div class="">We as observers find ourselves in those loops as we do the science.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">One can look for simple recursions that only involve contiguity and yet perform some complex task. </div><div class="">For example, suppose we consider strings involving entities I denote by star, left paren and right paren.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">* { }</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Suppose that in the single dimension of the line they interact as follows (one dimensional “particle interactions”)</div><div class="">** becomes {*} and</div><div class="">}{ cancels to nothing.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Take that as our universe with its particle interactions.</div><div class="">I will use —> for “becomes”.</div><div class="">Then</div><div class="">** —> {*}</div><div class="">*** —> {*}*</div><div class="">**** —> {*}** —> {*}{*} —> {* *} —> {{*}}</div><div class="">***** —> {*}(*}* —> {**}* —> {{*}}*</div><div class="">****** —> {*}(*}** —> {*}{*}{*} —> {* *}{*} —> {***} —> {{*}*}*</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">If you play with this and if YOU interpret a row of stars as a number so that * is 1, ** is 2, *** is 3 and so on</div><div class="">then you can prove that {X} corresponds to multiplying X by two (as above {{*}} corresponds to 2 x 2 x 1) and that </div><div class="">a string of stars will reduce to a “coded” version of its form in the binary system!</div><div class="">WE see all that as particle theorists about this small world.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The little world with its particles *,},{ does not “know” any of this.</div><div class="">It just operates by the interaction rules</div><div class="">** —> {*}</div><div class="">}{ —> </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The same thing seems to be the case for the complexity of the DNA/RNA system. </div><div class="">So we see coding in the sense of syntax//meaning, while the system operates according to specific and complex patterns.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">It is useful for us to think of coding, but we do not know how the rules and structures in the molecular biology actually evolved.</div><div class="">In that question lies one future for this kind of science.</div><div class="">Best,</div><div class="">Lou</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""> P.S. If you play with the little world of * and { and } you will realize that in one dimension you want to allow AB = BA when A and B are legally parenthesized expressions.</div><div class="">Thus {*}*{*} should be allowed to become {*}{*}* —> {**}* —> {{*}}*.</div><div class="">This would, in one dimension, require a lot of rules. </div><div class="">For that reason I would reformulate the small particle world into a two dimensional</div><div class="">world where {*} would be an enclosure of * by a closed curve (say a circle). </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Then “objects” can move around in the two dimensions and interact. </div><div class="">AB can float about and turn into BA by the B going off the line and floating over the A and landing on the other side of the A. </div><div class="">Apparent complexities are accomplished by more geometry. </div><div class="">Three dimensional space is enough for many purposes.</div><div class="">Any graphical network can be embedded in three dimensional space.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">PP.S. There is coding in the sense of cryptography and </div><div class="">coding in the sense of computer programming. </div><div class="">You will notice that we are playing here with the relationships of these two meanings of coding.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Oct 6, 2021, at 7:57 AM, Marcus Abundis <<a href="mailto:55mrcs@gmail.com" class="">55mrcs@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">Dear all,<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The discussion on code I found interesting, but I did not see enough specificity for it to lead me anywhere useful. For example, how exactly is code constructed (what are its 'universals' or 'primitives')?, who is constructing it?, who is interpreting it?, and to what end exactly? These seem like basic issues I did not see named (did I miss it?)</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The discussion on duality I have a similar reaction, interesting, but where is it headed?, what are key dualist constituents (primitives)?, are we speaking of simple binary (1,0) ways of thinking, or? The problem with any dualist view I have seen is that they are not innately creative – it is 'input' and 'output' thinking (in a most general sense), it cannot get to 'input', 'processing', and 'output' needed for creativity. This dates way back to Pre-Socratic dialectic logic . . . It is for this reason that I have always had problems with Joe's LIR (Logic in Reality) – last I checked it was STILL an essentially dualist model . . . and then 'processing' often becomes a challenging Black Box.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I posted a dualist-triune approach that does cover creativity, and which has abundant evidence. For those interested, it is covered in my IS4SI talk, which can be viewed here: </div><div class=""><a href="https://youtu.be/2rS9uT08YP8" class="">https://youtu.be/2rS9uT08YP8</a><br class=""></div><div class="">A cursory companion paper (5.5 pages) can be found here (sans references):</div><div class=""><a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/1VoNCuIE2KcDWRV92iKFR4zevIcTQcQmP/view?usp=sharing" class="">https://drive.google.com/file/d/1VoNCuIE2KcDWRV92iKFR4zevIcTQcQmP/view?usp=sharing</a><br class=""></div><div class="">A more detailed companion paper (10 pages) can be found here (with references):</div><a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/1r1eGAe_1lkXPGbS2cVoja4n6CyGtzVlW/view?usp=sharing" class="">https://drive.google.com/file/d/1r1eGAe_1lkXPGbS2cVoja4n6CyGtzVlW/view?usp=sharing</a><br class="gmail-Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I look forward to further thoughts on dualist thinking and hope this material somehow adds to the 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