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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=ZH-CN link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" style='text-justify-trim:punctuation'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体;color:black'>Dear </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体;color:black'>Krassimir</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体;color:black'>,</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体;color:black'>Please criticize and correct the following reply.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>What is methodical error in physics is that the different physical interactions like gravitation are assumed as information. <br><br></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>After nearly 70 years of efforts on information, we have formed the following unified view: information is generated by human reflection, and then there are two basic processes: communication and processing. However, the concept of information used by physicists does not follow this pattern. For example, in their latest statement: The world is created by the mediation of quantum waves of information.</span>】<span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Can one describe what kind of information "Comet A can transmits to comet B". </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:宋体'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>This only is a hypothesis. Communication between different celestial bodies may or may not exist. It doesn't affect our informational judgment. There is always communication between two dogs.</span>】<span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Only physical, chemical or mechanical interactions may exists in the not living nature.</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Biological, psychological and sociological interactions are specific only for living creatures.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>Both agree and disagree, whether information exists only in living creatures has been discussed numberless time in FIS.</span>】<span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>"<i>Does the moon exist when no one sees it?</i>" </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Yes, it exists, but it doesn't know anything about itself as well as it is not recognized as an object by other objects.<br>The same is valid for all objects in the nature.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>Fundamental Information Studies cannot violate the principles of quantum mechanics. Instead, we can draw inspiration from there.</span>】<span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Finally, I could not understand what means“the black hole information is physical”.<br>Please, can you describe the “physical information”.<br>Is it the same as the reflection i.e. some structural or functional changes after physical, chemical or mechanical interactions?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:宋体;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>When a physical object was reflected by any reflector, we say that the information is physical. In my deep statement, first, it is physical, and second, it is human. For example, genetic information, which is cellular (and, of course, physical, molecular...) But it's also human.</span>】</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>These discussions relate to a basic concept that I put forward to distinguish different information and different informatics: INFORWARE. Which are deeply described in my book "<i>Information Science: Concept, System and Prospect</i> (Beijing, 2016, Science Press, Chinese Edition)".</span>】</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:21.0pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:宋体'>【<span lang=EN-US>This is my second post this week, and according to FIS, I can only reply to one post later.</span>】<span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'><br></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Best wishes,</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Xueshan</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <a href="mailto:yxs@pku.edu.cn" title="yxs@pku.edu.cn">Xueshan Yan</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>Sent:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> Monday, October 12, 2020 4:13 AM<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>To:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <a href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" title="fis@listas.unizar.es">FIS</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>Subject:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> Re: [Fis] black hole and information<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>Dear Krassimir,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:6.0pt;mso-para-margin-top:.5gd;text-indent:27.0pt;line-height:17.0pt;mso-line-height-rule:exactly'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>Very sorry for my late reply.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:12.0pt;mso-para-margin-top:1.0gd;text-indent:27.0pt;line-height:17.0pt;mso-line-height-rule:exactly'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>1. Yes, your statement "<i>The Nobel Prize is given to <b>researchers</b> but not to the Black hole.</i>" is more precise than my "<i>This year's Nobel Prize in physics goes to black hole <b>research</b></i>".<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:12.0pt;mso-para-margin-top:1.0gd;text-indent:27.0pt;line-height:17.0pt;mso-line-height-rule:exactly'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>2. "<i>Without observer there is no black hole entropy, there is no information</i>." Inadvertently, you have raised a quantum mechanical question of information. If we can remember, Einstein and Bohr have a long debate that has an essential impact on quantum mechanics. That is "<i>Does the moon exist when no one sees it?</i>" If there isn’t any human observer, does "black hole entropy or information" exist? I don't know.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:12.0pt;mso-para-margin-top:1.0gd;text-indent:27.0pt;line-height:17.0pt;mso-line-height-rule:exactly'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>3. "Comet A can transmits <b>information</b> to comet B", this <b>information</b> about the behavior of the two comets greatly enriches our understanding of astrophysics. Here, the first information is physical and the second is human. Therefore, in my immature view, your "<i>Consciousness is needed to reflect reality and to assume some reflections as information</i>." is a human informatics problem, while the black hole information is physical.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:12.0pt;mso-para-margin-top:1.0gd;text-indent:27.0pt;line-height:17.0pt;mso-line-height-rule:exactly'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>Karl's prediction is a great encouragement to us and will come true soon, let's be ready to accept the prize next year or later.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:12.0pt;mso-para-margin-top:1.0gd;text-indent:0cm;line-height:17.0pt;mso-line-height-rule:exactly'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>Best wishes,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black'>Xueshan<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> <a href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es">fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es</a> <<a href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es">fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es</a>> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Krassimir Markov<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 6, 2020 10:18 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:yxs@pku.edu.cn">yxs@pku.edu.cn</a>; FIS Group <<a href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es">fis@listas.unizar.es</a>><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fis] black hole and information<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Dear Xueshan,</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>I have only one remark.<br>The Nobel Prize is given to researchers but not to the Black hole and not to any other object in the Cosmos!</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><br>Without observer there is no Black hole entropy, there is no information.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>So, the consciousness is needed to reflect reality and to assume some reflections as information.</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Friendly greetings</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Krassimir</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><a href="mailto:yxs@pku.edu.cn" title="yxs@pku.edu.cn"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>Xueshan Yan</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>Sent:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> Tuesday, October 06, 2020 3:37 PM<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>To:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><a href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" title="fis@listas.unizar.es"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>FIS Group</span></a></span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal;background:whitesmoke'><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'>Subject:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'> [Fis] black hole and information<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Dear colleagues</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>，<span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>This year's Nobel Prize in physics goes to black hole research today. When the curvature of space-time of a celestial body is so large that even light cannot escape from its event horizon, we call it a black hole. I. Once a black hole is formed, except for mass, angular momentum, and electric charge, all the previous material properties as objects disappear; II. The horizon area of the black hole is equal to its entropy (entropy equals negative information). These two issues form a close relationship between the research of black hole and information. The follow-up effect of this year's Nobel Prize in physics may lead to further thinking on the information in the future by astrophysicists, and lay a reverie foundation for the informational interpretation of matter several years later.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'> </span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Best wishes and health,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Xueshan<o:p></o:p></span></p><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center;text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'><hr size=4 width="100%" align=center></span></div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:0cm;line-height:normal'><span 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