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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Dear Krassimir, Christophe and All,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>This last exchange is very good. It also brings out aspects of
Christophe’s MGS, which I had missed previously, that facilitate a
dynamic interpretation of information. Models begin to ‘move’, so
as to resemble better what they are modelling.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Please note that depending on how it is used, meaningless
information can also be disinformation. “Cuomo (the Governor of the State
of <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">New York</st1:place></st1:State>)
should have bought ventilators in 2015.” For us, this is just a ridiculous
opinion, but for Trump’s undiscerning audience, his ‘base’,
it is disinformation or rather disinforming that I consider criminal. It is
morality that cannot be relativized to a social context, not information.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Keep well,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Joseph<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
Fis [mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On
Behalf Of </span></b>Krassimir Markov<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> jeudi, 26 mars 2020 23:46<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Christophe Menant; FIS<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Fis] defining
information</span></font><span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Dear Christophe and
FIS Colleagues,</span></font><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>I wish you strong
health and patience to avoid this very dangerous virus!</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>About meaning:</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>“<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p><b><i><font size=4 color=red face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;
font-family:Calibri;color:red;font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>A meaning </span></font></i></b><i><font
size=4 color=red><span style='font-size:13.5pt;color:red;font-style:italic'>is
meaningful information</span></font></i><i><font size=4 color=black><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;color:black;font-style:italic'> that is generated by a
system submitted to a constraint when it receives </span></font></i><i><font
size=4 color=red><span style='font-size:13.5pt;color:red;font-style:italic'>an
external information</span></font></i><i><font size=4 color=black><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;color:black;font-style:italic'> that has a connection
with the constraint. </span></font></i><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><em><b><i><font size=4 color=red face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;
font-family:Calibri;color:red;font-weight:bold'>The meaning is formed</span></font></i></b></em><em><b><i><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black;font-weight:bold'> of the connection existing between the </span></font></i></b></em><em><b><i><font
size=4 color=red face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:red;font-weight:bold'>received information</span></font></i></b></em><em><b><i><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black;font-weight:bold'> and the constraint of the system</span></font></i></b></em><em><i><font
size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:13.5pt;
color:black'>. The function of the meaning is to participate to the
determination of an action that will be implemented in order to satisfy the
constraint of the system. </span></font></i></em><font size=4 color=black><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>“</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>We still do not know
what is information, so it is difficult to define meaning.</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>I think your idea is
very near to what we need but I prefer another way to say the same.</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>INFOS reflects the
surrounding environment via his/her sensors(receptors). Signals from
sensors(receptors) via some transfer mechanism like neurons come to the brain
or to the central memory of INFOS. Interconnected signals form interconnected
active points in the memory. Such formation is called “mental
model” of the reflected reality. The same is happen when one or more
active memory formation(s) is(are) reflected in another such one. This is again
“mental model” but of the subjective internal reality. So we have
two types of mental models – “objective”and
“subjective”, taking in account that the “objective”
means the end of subjective reflection chain which starts from sensors and ends
in the brain, i.e. it is subjective reflection of the objective reality, the
second is subjective reflection of subjective reality.</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Now, if INFOS can
interconnect one mental model with another one(s) the first model receive
meaning. If another interconnection is done, another meaning of the same model
will exist.</span></font><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>The interconnections
are mental models, too.</span></font><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>So, mental model with
meaning is information.</span></font><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Mental model without
meaning is data.</span></font><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Maybe in the next
letter I shall explain this on the base of the test bed.</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Many thanks to all who
read my post (more than 180 reads).</span></font><font size=4 color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Be healthy and happy!</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Friendly greetings</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Krassimir</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:christophe.menant@hotmail.fr" title="christophe.menant@hotmail.fr">Christophe
Menant</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> Thursday, March 26,
2020 9:29 PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" title="fis@listas.unizar.es">fis@listas.unizar.es</a>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> Re:
[Fis] defining information<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color="#201f1e" face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:#201F1E;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;
padding:0cm'>Dear FISers,<br>
Going through hard times should not stop us from exchanging ideas.<br>
My two cents: <br>
When trying to define information we should keep in mind that information
exists to carry meanings and is used for meaning management. If there is no
need for meanings, information does not have to exist.<br>
Assuming that we accept meaning as the core of information, we can reach some
simple definitions like:<i><span style='font-style:italic'> information is any
energy variation that conveys meaning or participates to meaning generation.</span></i>
(The former is about meaningful information, the latter includes meaningless
Information). This definition can be used for humans, animals and artificial
agents. But it needs to explicit what is a meaning and what is meaning
generation. <br>
As we have already talked about, this has been done by proposing a model for
meaning generation (the MGS) which allows to:<br>
- Define a meaning, a meaningful information, and tell what a meaning is for.<br>
- Relate meaning to agency and to constraint satisfaction.<br>
- Differentiate artificial agents from organic ones.<br>
- Define agency and autonomy.<br>
- Identify some limits of today AI .<br>
- Introduce evolutionary scenarios for cognition, intentionality and
self-consciousness.<br>
- Highlight some possible sources of human mental health problems.<br>
This is more than we need to consider that defining information as a meaning
carrier (with a definition of meaning) can be a valid option. <br>
(a short paper at </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black'><a
href="https://philpapers.org/rec/MENITA-7"><span lang=EN-US>https://philpapers.org/rec/MENITA-7</span></a></span></font><font
color="#201f1e"><span lang=EN-US style='color:#201F1E;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;
padding:0cm'> gives access to the above subjects). <br>
Let’s again recall that the proposed approach is an evolutionary one. It
does not take information as managed by humans as a starting point. This is
deliberate, in order to avoid having to consider human consciousness and free
will in our starting point. These human performances are complex and not
clearly understood by science and philosophy. Taking them into account, even
implicitly, would make our starting point unnecessarily complex. The choice
made here is to start with a case as simple as possible (meaning generation in
animals) and look at human performances as the result of an evolutionary
approach. <br>
<br>
Hoping that you and your families are all well in the difficult times we are
going through, I wish you the best.<br>
Christophe</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="98%" align=center tabIndex=-1 style='display:inline-block'>
</span></font></div>
<div id=divRplyFwdMsg>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black;font-weight:bold'>De :</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'> Fis <fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es> de la part de Francesco
Rizzo <13francesco.rizzo@gmail.com><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Envoyé :</span></b> lundi 23 mars 2020 07:49<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>À :</span></b> Joseph Brenner <<st1:PersonName
w:st="on">joe.brenner@bluewin.ch</st1:PersonName>><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc :</span></b> fis@listas.unizar.es >>
fis@listas.unizar.es <fis@listas.unizar.es>; Pedro C. Marijuan
<pcmarijuan.iacs@aragon.es>; Emanuel Diamant <emanl.245@gmail.com><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Objet :</span></b> Re: [Fis] defining
information</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Carissimo Joseph, <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Ti ringrazio di cuore
per il Tuo affettuoso augurio di buona salute alla mia famiglia. Grazie a Dio e
anche agli uomini di buona <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>capacita e volontà
stiamo bene.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Mi permetto di
scriverTi che, non solo secondo me, ma anche per il giudizio-pensiero di altri
studiosi, molto più autorevoli del<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>sottoscritto:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>* l'equilibrio (che
sarebbe bene o meglio cambiare con armonia, anche del dis-accordo) può
paragonarsi ad una tautologia<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>che al pari
dell'ideologia è una falsa co-scienza; difatti l'equilibrio entropico è
mortale, il dis-equilibrio neg-enropico è vitale;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>* per quanto riguarda
il rapporto tra energia e informazione, bisogna dire che l'energia libera non è
altro che una forma di in-<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>formazione
(neg-entropica), mentre l'energia degradata (non più trasformabile in lavoro
utile o meccanico) non è altro che<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>una forma di
dis-in-formazione (entropica);<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>* è necessario
ricordare che v'ha un tempo per essere generalisti e un tempo per essere
specialisti: quando si dà luogo ad <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>un'iniziativa
pregevole, preziosa e profetica come la FIS, nata per merito di Pedro, prima
bisogna. essere generalisti e poi <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>specialisti, sapendo
che il prima serve il poi.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Carissimo Joseph,
leggo sempre con molta attenzione i Tuoi autorevoli interventi-messaggi e sono
sempre più convinto che solo<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>il rilancio della
filosofia possa costituire la base onto-metodo-logica della definizione e della
narrazione-processo della LEGGE <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>DELL'INFORMAZIONE,
senza trascurare la scienza mediatrice dell'economia.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>DateVi e diamoci da
fare, perché molta strada ancora bisogna percorrere e sperimentare.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Un abbraccio
affettuoso a Te ed ai Tuoi cari, estensibile a Tutti, con l'amore della fede,
della perseveranza e del coraggio.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Grazie, grazie,
grazie.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Francesco.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Il giorno ven 20 mar
2020 alle ore 11:21 Joseph Brenner <<a href="mailto:joe.brenner@bluewin.ch">joe.brenner@bluewin.ch</a>>
ha scritto:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;
margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'>
<div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Dear Francesco,</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Please let me first express the hope that you and your family are
in good health and in a safe configuration.<i><span style='font-style:italic'> </span></i></span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>As to the content of your note, however, there are a couple of
things that I think need more discussion. I would not make the absolute cut
made by Wheeler between energy and information, and I think that Prigogine did
not pay enough attention to the complexity of processes <i><span
style='font-style:italic'>close </span></i>to equilibrium.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>On the other hand, I think that your formulation of measure as a
qualitative quantity or a quantitative quality implies exactly the kind of
dialectical approach one should take to understanding information in <i><span
style='font-style:italic'>its </span></i>complexity. </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><i><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy;font-style:italic'>Sta bene</span></font></i><font size=2
color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";color:navy'>,</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=2 color=navy face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
color:navy'>Joseph</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=xmsonormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> Fis [mailto:<a
href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es" target="_blank">fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es</a>]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Francesco Rizzo<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> vendredi, 20 mars 2020 10:48<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Krassimir Markov<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> <a
href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" target="_blank">fis@listas.unizar.es</a>
>> <a href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" target="_blank">fis@listas.unizar.es</a>;
Pedro C. Marijuan; Emanuel Diamant<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Fis] defining
information</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Cari Pedro, Joseph, Krassimir, Terry e
Tutti gli altri,</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>tenendo presente quel che avete scritto in
questi ultimi tempi, desidero dirVi alcune cose che potrebbero essere utili </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>per stabilire il quadro o scenario della
discussione FIS, senza alcuna presunzione o pretesa.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>*Ciò che mi spinge a partecipare al
confronto-dibattito è la mia teoria del valore (economico) basata sulla
combinazione</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>creativa di energia, informazione e
materia, sapendo che sia l'energia sia la materia sono forme di informazione;
quindi</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>posso in sintesi affermare che la mia
teoria sia basata sul valore dell'informazione o della tras-informazione (di
cui la FIS </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>nel passato s'è occupata): da quì il
valore della forma o la forma del valore. </span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>* Il grande fisico J. A. Wheeler, il guru
della scienza dell'informazione che portò i buchi neri all'interno dell'analisi
fisico-astronomica, </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>sostiene che l'unica legge fondamentale
della scienza naturale sia quella dell'informazione, non dell'energia o della
materia.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>* Questo vale ancora di più per le scienze
umane e sociali (di cui l'economia dovrebbe essere la regina).</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>* Allora bisogna concentrare l'attenzione
sull'unità di ogni forma di sapere, rifacendoci alla Nuova Alleanza di Ilya
Prigogine</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>che ha inventato-scoperto le
"strutture dissipative che creano ordine dal disordine mediante
fluttuazioni o instabilità"; questa è la fonte</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>di ogni informazione, sia delle scienze
naturali che umane: il concetto di neg-entropia o informazione vitale di E.
Schrodinger </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>la dice lunga in proposito.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>* Esistono tante categorie o forme di
informazione: naturale o termodinamica, genetica o genomica, matematica o
cibernetica, </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>semiotico-semantica. Esse possono rifarsi
tutte allo stesso quadro definitorio: l'informazione è un processo che tende a
dare forma</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>a tutti e a tutto, dis-informazione è il
contrario (cfr. Rizzo F., "Scienza dell'amore o amore della scienza",
Aracne editrice, Roma 2019,</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>soprattutto i capitoli 2 e 3 dedicati a
Socrate, Platone e Aristotele).</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>*Invece sono diverse le misure di queste
tipologie di informazione che, tuttavia, possono supportare, grossomodo, la
stessa definizione.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>*Infine, ma potrei dire all'inizio, quel
che non bisogna dimenticare è la lezione di scienza della logica che ci ha dato
G:W. Hegel: </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>fra i tanti suoi triangoli,
consiglio quello che ai tre vertici porta qualità, quantità e misura: la misura
è una quantità qualitativa o una </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>qualità quantitativa. Questo consente di
dosare (dialetticamente, direbbe il nostro filosofo) il dosaggio delle
misurazioni delle </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>diverse forme di informazione.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Sono stato più lungo di quanto prevedevo e
Vi chiedo scusa anche per l'uso della mia lingua.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Un saluto affettuoso ed un augurio molto
forte -- richiesto dai tempi in cui (la) corona (di un).virus ha un potere
.demoniaco -- al fine di</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>non abbassare la guardia.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Francesco</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Il giorno mar 17 mar 2020 alle ore 20:56
Krassimir Markov <<a href="mailto:markov@foibg.com" target="_blank">markov@foibg.com</a>>
ha scritto:</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;
margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Dear Pedro, Emanuel
and FIS Colleagues,</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>1.Thank you for your
remarks and interesting ideas.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Especially those which
are aimed to make our communication possible in such situation like this in the
world now.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>I have no information
about plans and possibilities of our Brazilian colleagues.</span></font><font
size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:14.0pt;
font-family:Calibri;color:black'> </span></font><font size=4 color=black
face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'>So, please write more details.</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>2. I agree with
Emanuel that: </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>The proposed definition of
information must be followed by a suggestion of assets that make it (the
information) visible, tangible, palpable. </span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>It was my goal when I
had proposed to prepare one or more test beds.</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>3. According to this,
now I want to invite you to see my preliminary proposal of a sample test bed
and evaluation tips for testing information definitions and theories.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>It is simple but, I
hope, contains the main objects and their interactions, which participate in
the (humans’!) information processes.</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Of course, it is only
one from many possible.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>If given definition or
theory is not applicable to this test bed, maybe it is possible another one to
be proposed.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Please see </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><a
href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fidr.ithea.org%2Ftiki-view_forum_thread.php%3Fcomments_parentId%3D37%26topics_sort_mode%3DlastPost_desc%26forumId%3D3&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433537719&sdata=xTapBEApzVF6ZDQEcMI4QFGCR039hh5HaYAZhG20zSM%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank"
title="http://idr.ithea.org/tiki-view_forum_thread.php?comments_parentId=37&topics_sort_mode=lastPost_desc&forumId=3"
shash="cxMoxJevdOB6aajg3H/O2sk661pdlaQktWd1qz2++lVotfLW+RsZ1LKebKyuwAoNaoDtsDobyK+WBaBBjPfgwTRKeZBUSKlNKyguFiQAjsHXVXHxjfNp83hy7pn5t5Gowx76EJUkJB7wIbhG+d2qe9X+m+XR5KKwv0COvtZE1D0="
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color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Already registered colleagues
may write directly in the Forum, other may use FIS mailing list as usual.</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>I whish you to be
HEALTHY, HEALTHY, HEALTHY, .... !!!</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Friendly greetings</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>Krassimir</span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:emanl.245@gmail.com" target="_blank"
title="emanl.245@gmail.com">Emanuel Diamant</a> </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black'> Tuesday, March 10, 2020 5:16 PM</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:pcmarijuan.iacs@aragon.es" target="_blank"
title="pcmarijuan.iacs@aragon.es">'Pedro C. Marijuan'</a> </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es" target="_blank"
title="fis@listas.unizar.es">fis@listas.unizar.es</a> </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal style='background:whitesmoke'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2
color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Tahoma;color:black'> [Fis] defining information</span></font><font color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>Dear Pedro, Dear FIS
colleagues, </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>I do not share the general
excitement about the revitalization of the FIS discussion on information
definition. </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>I am not sure that the
principle of “three messages per week” or the ITHEA Cloud Forum,
with an </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>unlimited number of posts and
1M-large attachments, is our main problem. I think that our discussion (again
and again) violates the basic principle of any scientific discourse - the
IF-THEN principle - according to which each hypothetical assumption is followed
by a suggestion what stems from it, where, and how these expectations could be
discerned and observed. If I remember right, Terence and Gordana on several
previous occasions have addressed this issue, but their call has remained
unanswered.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>However, refreshing the
definitions of information we cannot continue to ignore the IF-THEN rule
requirement - How does the defined information look like, how it is
represented, what is its real form? The proposed definition of information must
be followed by a suggestion of assets that make it (the information) visible,
tangible, palpable. </span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>Only this kind of information
definitions is being urgently needed in the worldwide Human Brain Research
programme. Or in the overhyped global Artificial Intelligence race. In both,
Artificial Neural Networks (which are data processing number crunching devices)
are supposed to emulate human brain biological neurons (which are pure
information processing devices). Both fail to fulfill their promises, but do
not understand for what reason and why. The current FIS discussion certainly
will not help them.</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=4 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:13.0pt;color:black'>Regards, Emanuel. </span></font><font
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
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Puede encontrar toda la información sobre como tratamos sus datos en el
siguiente enlace: <a
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Recuerde que si está suscrito a una lista voluntaria Ud. puede darse de baja
desde la propia aplicación en el momento en que lo desee.<br>
<a
href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistas.unizar.es%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433547713&sdata=yDsaqe2KWrKqNVhf0Kdr3t4NL%2FjY3EF73brFn%2FwEcsM%3D&reserved=0"
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<p class=xmsonormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
Fis mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Fis@listas.unizar.es" target="_blank">Fis@listas.unizar.es</a><br>
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href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistas.unizar.es%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ffis&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433557707&sdata=AWiRY9nN%2FNAf25msoDaV1GFyxB29jkvXDKcsxwOXKGE%3D&reserved=0"
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originalsrc="http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis">http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis</a><br>
----------<br>
INFORMACIÓN SOBRE PROTECCIÓN DE DATOS DE CARÁCTER PERSONAL<br>
<br>
Ud. recibe este correo por pertenecer a una lista de correo gestionada por la
Universidad de Zaragoza.<br>
Puede encontrar toda la información sobre como tratamos sus datos en el
siguiente enlace: <a
href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fsicuz.unizar.es%2Finformacion-sobre-proteccion-de-datos-de-caracter-personal-en-listas&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433557707&sdata=L1TM3BPBQ9bzoRc7e98V2GuiFREd697NEbYaZl%2FOjMk%3D&reserved=0"
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originalsrc="https://sicuz.unizar.es/informacion-sobre-proteccion-de-datos-de-caracter-personal-en-listas">https://sicuz.unizar.es/informacion-sobre-proteccion-de-datos-de-caracter-personal-en-listas</a><br>
Recuerde que si está suscrito a una lista voluntaria Ud. puede darse de baja
desde la propia aplicación en el momento en que lo desee.<br>
<a
href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistas.unizar.es%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433557707&sdata=M9Y%2FUfi20dW%2BSKef4bArrXA9o3zb0K2qjvlIrrP7Uyg%3D&reserved=0"
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originalsrc="http://listas.unizar.es/">http://listas.unizar.es</a><br>
----------</span></font><font color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-family:
Calibri;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div id="x_gmail-m_-4505537609629358338DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2">
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'>
<hr size=1 width="99%" noshade color="#909090" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0
style='border-collapse:collapse'>
<tr>
<td style='padding:0cm 9.4pt 0cm 5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><a
href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.avast.com%2Fantivirus&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433567698&sdata=U84e2fOoas%2FyHd6za3GS9xCkAuRpZCij%2FzB72wxvuEE%3D&reserved=0"
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shash="ERkGvZ03Vx4RUXPDI5GqClwWpwDy3A3Tlpy7o33uDtFNQWbqlpElDK5KHi5CiutCjJVS9gHmwW5JuyOQvUjMUG3CHDDgbDC047WxmtClN2h67xYZvbiS3H1ipK8gnHt4TD/342zmhDFwaJtee8WssS8DgE6i8X5qVN6oqDbWp4o="
originalsrc="https://www.avast.com/antivirus"><span style='text-decoration:
none'><img border=0 width=90 height=33 id="_x0000_i1029"
src="http://static.avast.com/emails/avast-mail-stamp.png" alt="Avast logo"></span></a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</td>
<td style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'>
<p><font size=3 color="#3d4d5a" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri;color:#3D4D5A'>L'absence de virus dans ce courrier
électronique a été vérifiée par le logiciel antivirus Avast. <br>
<a
href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.avast.com%2Fantivirus&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf637a7bca2144a22f0f708d7cef6818b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637205430433567698&sdata=U84e2fOoas%2FyHd6za3GS9xCkAuRpZCij%2FzB72wxvuEE%3D&reserved=0"
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shash="ERkGvZ03Vx4RUXPDI5GqClwWpwDy3A3Tlpy7o33uDtFNQWbqlpElDK5KHi5CiutCjJVS9gHmwW5JuyOQvUjMUG3CHDDgbDC047WxmtClN2h67xYZvbiS3H1ipK8gnHt4TD/342zmhDFwaJtee8WssS8DgE6i8X5qVN6oqDbWp4o="
originalsrc="https://www.avast.com/antivirus">www.avast.com</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</td>
</tr>
</table>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
Fis mailing list<br>
Fis@listas.unizar.es<br>
http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis<br>
----------<br>
INFORMACISN SOBRE PROTECCISN DE DATOS DE CARACTER PERSONAL<br>
<br>
Ud. recibe este correo por pertenecer a una lista de correo gestionada por la
Universidad de Zaragoza.<br>
Puede encontrar toda la informacisn sobre como tratamos sus datos en el
siguiente enlace: https://sicuz.unizar.es/informacion-sobre-proteccion-de-datos-de-caracter-personal-en-listas<br>
Recuerde que si esta suscrito a una lista voluntaria Ud. puede darse de baja
desde la propia aplicacisn en el momento en que lo desee.<br>
http://listas.unizar.es<br>
----------<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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