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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear</span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Søren,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thank you for a positive
and constructive note and question. Although I maintain my critique of Peirce’s
tychism and synechism and his concepts of and manipulations of signs and
diagrams, I have always seen value in many of his intuitions. I would be glad
to consider him a ‘humanist with a semiotic worldview’. It takes
all kinds . . . <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I think for participants
in this list to say what they mean by reality, exactly for, as you put it, a discussion
of the ontology and science behind various informational paradigms, would be
very useful. Pedro, what do you think? For me reality is change and stability,
being and becoming, appearance and, contradictorially, the reality behind
appearance. This is why standard logic doesn’t work. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Best Season’s
Greetings,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Joseph<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>P.S. Perhaps a typo, but
what is the sense of ‘treading’ in ‘treading processual
concept’?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=3 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
Søren Brier [mailto:sbr.msc@cbs.dk] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> samedi, 16 décembre 2017
13:28<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Joseph
Brenner</st1:PersonName>; <st1:PersonName w:st="on">fis</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [Fis] Comes the
Revolution</span></font><span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=DA style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>Dear Joseph<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=DA style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>This very Peircean of you as “</span></font><font
size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The
challenge is to reconcile our roles as informational organisms and agents
within nature and as stewards of nature.” is at the centre of
Peirce’s thinking instead that he uses the treading processual concept of
sign instead of information as his basic concept . I know that many call Peirce
an objective idealist, although it is a form of realism I am not sure that this
concept covers his combination of Tychism and synechism with a semiotic
worldview. I think Peirce’s view is unique. But you<font color=navy><span
style='color:navy'>r</span></font> mail do<font color=navy><span
style='color:navy'>es</span></font> put the focus on the importance of
discussion the ontology behind the various informational paradigms.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>What do we mean when we use the term real for
instance about </span></font><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Lupasco’s physical –
biological – contradictorial information</span></font><font size=2
face=Calibri><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>? As
I understand the term has been pretty important for your view.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'> Best<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>
Søren<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Calibri><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>
Fis [mailto:<st1:PersonName w:st="on">fis</st1:PersonName>-bounces@listas.unizar.es]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b><st1:PersonName
w:st="on">Joseph Brenner</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 16. december 2017 10:15<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">fis</st1:PersonName>
<<st1:PersonName w:st="on">fis</st1:PersonName>@listas.unizar.es><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [Fis] Comes the
Revolution<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span lang=DA
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Dear Pedro, Dear FISers,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>I regret that I have difficulty in relating to the
current FIS discussion, but that is my problem. I see little progress since the
appearance of Lupasco’s physical – biological –
contradictorial information; Kauffman, Logan’s biotic and
Ulanowicz’ apophatic information; Deacon’s Shannon –
Boltzmann – Darwin information; and Wu’s revolution.
Sungchul’s intuition of an “irreversible triadic relation”
reflects the power of triads as cognitive attractors, but discussion is blocked
by his use of the word ‘irreversible’, required by the underlying
idealist Peircean structure of his argument. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>What I would like to see is the foundations of
information being discussed in relation to the real problems of society, beyond
questionnaires. Some of these led yesterday to a prohibition of the use of
seven words including foetus, diversity and science-based from certain U. S.
Government documents. I think we need to have in the forefront of our minds the
statement made by Floridi in his 2010 book, <i><span style='font-style:italic'>Information.
A Very Short Introduction </span></i>(which all of you have read, of course):
“The challenge is to reconcile our roles as informational organisms and
agents within nature and as stewards of nature.”<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>I believe that such a perspective, placed as a
criterion for selection of pertinent concepts, would make our discussions a lot
deeper and more relevant. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Thank you and best wishes,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Joesph<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='line-height:13.5pt'><font size=2 color="#41424e"
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