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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Alex<br>
a main problem I see with Brillouin (the same as with Shannon)<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.bibnum.education.fr/calculinformatique/theorie-de-l-information/naissance-de-la-theorie-de-l-information">https://www.bibnum.education.fr/calculinformatique/theorie-de-l-information/naissance-de-la-theorie-de-l-information</a><br>
is that he speaks about the transmission of information (with
regard to Shannon), while in fact it is a message and not
'information' that is being transmitted.<br>
This quid pro quo is amazing in a scientist like Brillouin who is
interested in the exact definition of concepts. Shannon's theory
is called A mathematical theory of communication (not: of
information). <br>
Rafael<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAKGpHchhmg70Nn7n6k-Z+bAW4nGsx31-8urOmRXGUa9JtjHgDw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">John, I read the English translation of Science and
Information theory in 1976 and was profoundly influenced by it.
I started doing so because I was trying to understand conscious
awareness at that time, and it struck me that information theory
was the closest thing to it in science at the time. (not being
impressed much by S's cat etc.)
<div>So you see it took 40 years thought for me to get to where
I am now. Even in 2008 when I had 90% of my present theory
worked out, I was not formulating it as a new theory of
information.</div>
<div>Reading and re-rereading (!) Shear and Chalmers was central
to that. And the fluid Reynolds number analogy which led me to
see that I did indeed have a genuine 'Double Aspect'
information theory of just the right kind.</div>
<div>Alex</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 8 July 2016 at 20:37, John Collier <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Collierj@ukzn.ac.za" target="_blank">Collierj@ukzn.ac.za</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="white" link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-CA">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
name="m_-9115177545001213115__MailEndCompose"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Comment
inserted below yours.</span></a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">John
Collier</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Professor
Emeritus and Senior Research Associate</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">University
of KwaZulu-Natal</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://web.ncf.ca/collier" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://web.ncf.ca/collier">http://web.ncf.ca/collier</a></a></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext"
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext"
lang="EN-US"> Fis [mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es">fis-bounces@listas.unizar.es</a></a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Michel Godron<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, 08 July 2016 4:52 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:fis@listas.unizar.es"
target="_blank">fis@listas.unizar.es</a>; <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:loet@leydesdorff.net"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:loet@leydesdorff.net">loet@leydesdorff.net</a></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fis] Essential Core?</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<span class="">
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p>My responses are in red</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Bien reçu votre message.
MERCI. Cordialement. M. Godron</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Le 08/07/2016 à 14:42, Pedro
C. Marijuan a écrit :</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dear FIS Colleagues,<br>
<br>
Some brief responses to the different parties:<br>
<br>
Marcus: there were several sessions dealing
with info physics, where I remember some
historical connotations with mechanics
emerged. Mostly 1998 and 2002 chaired by
Koichiro Matsuno and 2004 by Michel Petitjean.
Afterwards the theme has surfaced relatively
often. About the present possibilities for a
UTI, my opinion is that strictly remaining
within Shannon's and anthropocentric discourse
boundaries there is no way out.
</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:red">Yes,
but it is not the same with Brillouin's
information : I could send to you a text in
French which gives a demonstration of the
convergence between that information and
thermodynamical neguentropy. Since twenty years,
I did not find an english review which was
interested by this problem, because I am
biologist and the biological reviews were not
interested.
</span></p>
</span>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">[John
Collier] I agree. I have read only an English
translation of Science and Information Theory.
I read it as an undergrad, and it has strongly
influenced my views. It is unfortunate, I
think, that it hasn’t influenced English
speaking scientists much. I have also seen
some bad misreadings of what he was saying.</span></i></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Prof.em. Dr. Rafael Capurro
Hochschule der Medien (HdM), Stuttgart, Germany
Capurro Fiek Foundation for Information Ethics (<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.capurro-fiek-foundation.org">http://www.capurro-fiek-foundation.org</a>)
Distinguished Researcher at the African Centre of Excellence for Information Ethics (ACEIE), Department of Information Science, University of Pretoria, South Africa.
Chair, International Center for Information Ethics (ICIE) (<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://icie.zkm.de">http://icie.zkm.de</a>)
Editor in Chief, International Review of Information Ethics (IRIE) (<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.i-r-i-e.net">http://www.i-r-i-e.net</a>)
Postal Address: Redtenbacherstr. 9, 76133 Karlsruhe, Germany
E-Mail: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rafael@capurro.de">rafael@capurro.de</a>
Voice: + 49 - 721 - 98 22 9 - 22 (Fax: -21)
Homepage: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.capurro.de">www.capurro.de</a>
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